How to attack with submarines?

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    • How to attack with submarines?

      I spotted a convoy from US on 10 player map. i declared war and sent the sub to attack. Still waiting, it appears I will still catch some of them disembarking. My question is this, will my subs auto attack future US convoys they see now that I am at war (like artillery) or will I have to manually watch for convoys and then manually attack them?
      "A good plan, violently executed now, is better than a perfect plan next week." - General George S. Patton, Jr.

      "Do, or do not. There is no try" - Yoda

    • Peter Mat wrote:

      will my subs auto attack future US convoys they see now that I am at war (like artillery) or will I have to manually watch for convoys and then manually attack them?
      If you are at war with the country in question, your submarine units will automatically attack all of the enemy country's convoys and warships that attempt to pass your subs on the same sea lane.

    • The best way to control how your naval units will act is to get High Command and then you can set your Fire Control to be aggressive. What this does for you is allow you to send your Navy in a patrol path around your waters.

      ***MontanaBB, take some notes here, you need them.

      With out the aggressive fire control unless your fleet is directly attacked it will keep moving in the path you gave it even if it becomes in range of the enemy. You told to them go somewhere and that is the orders your units have. When you set the fire control to be aggressive if they come anywhere near an enemy and are in range to attack it, that is what will happen. It will stop to kill any enemy in it's range. This is what you want to send out a fleet to clear the orphan units that bring grown men to tears. Very simple to do but there is some effort involved.

      "It is even better to act quickly and err than to hesitate until the time of action is past." - Karl Von Clausewitz

    • ATownGtr wrote:

      ***MontanaBB, take some notes here, you need them.
      Not really

      One of the key reasons for my high kills-to-losses ratios is that I actively manage my attacks and do not rely on automatic functions to make my decisions for me while I am not logged on. There is so much more you can do to your advantage when you are actively managing your attacks -- including, I might add, avoiding submarine attacks when the enemy unit stack has a qualitative advantage (e.g., a significant number of high-level destroyers).

      I played with the "High Command" functions when they were offered to me for free on a trial basis, and they are inconsistent with my style of play and battle management. Your mileage may vary.

    • Therefore, Without High Command (sorry to new and not yet - maybe fathers day):
      • My subs should attack an enemy convoy if they are parked on a sea dot and a convoy uses that dot as a way-point.
      • If my subs ate traveling a patrol path, they will not attack as they are ordered to move. (with High Command and set to aggressive they will attack)
      • Not sure what will happen if I click attack on a moving convoy and the convoy outruns me. Suspect this will only work if the convoy is headed at me, or it is disembarking.
      In the attached, the convoy beat the sub to the first way-point, the sub has the advantage to the second way-point. The other subs are in pursuit waiting for a landing spot as I think the convoy is faster. Everything is traveling South.
      "A good plan, violently executed now, is better than a perfect plan next week." - General George S. Patton, Jr.

      "Do, or do not. There is no try" - Yoda

    • Peter Mat wrote:

      Not sure what will happen if I click attack on a moving convoy and the convoy outruns me.
      All convoys that are transporting ground units or air units move at 27 kmh. L1 submarine units move at 30 kmh; L6 subs move at 48 kmh. If you want to close the gap more quickly to attack, you can increase the speed of the subs by 50% by using the forced march function (e.g., L1 subs move at 45 kmh on forced march).

      Note that your convoys of warships that do not include transports for ground or air units will move at the speed of the slowest unit in the stack, not necessarily at 27 kmh. For example, if an L1 battleship is present in the stack, the convoy will move at the speed of the L1 battleship, i.e., at 27 kmh. All other warships move faster than 27 kmh

      Peter Mat wrote:

      S*** he put a destroyer with this batch.
      The presence of a destroyer squadron is not necessarily fatal to the submarine unit. It depends on the research levels of the sub and DD units; use the unit spec sheets (which are broken out by research level) to compare the sub unit's anti-ship attack values vs. the DD unit's ant-sub (ASW) attack values. An L6 sub squadron will easily best an L1 DD squadron.

    • Peter Mat wrote:

      My subs should attack an enemy convoy if they are parked on a sea dot and a convoy uses that dot as a way-point.
      Also, there appears to be a misunderstanding here. Your sub unit does not have to be on an intersection point of two sea lanes for it to attack an enemy convoy or naval unit. If you are at war, and your sub makes physical contact with an enemy convoy or naval unit, it will attack. This will occur anywhere on any sealane, not only at the waypoints or intersections. Submarines must make physical contact to attack; however, destroyer, cruiser and battleships have a "standoff" attack capability, whereby they may attack the sub unit from the range of their naval guns and do not have to make physical contact with the sub unit. This is obviously the better way to destroy subs, because while the DDs are damaging the subs, the subs are not damaging the DDs.

    • Clarification understood.

      Though it makes sense to use the dots as park points, as there are (I believe) 4 sea lanes in and out of each dot. if you pick one lane you may miss traffic traveling through the other 3. Therefore it makes sense to park on the dot as you will get a greater number of intercepts (in theory).
      "A good plan, violently executed now, is better than a perfect plan next week." - General George S. Patton, Jr.

      "Do, or do not. There is no try" - Yoda

    • Peter Mat wrote:

      Though it makes sense to use the dots as park points, as there are (I believe) 4 sea lanes in and out of each dot. if you pick one lane you may miss traffic traveling through the other 3. Therefore it makes sense to park on the dot as you will get a greater number of intercepts (in theory).

      That is a good, first order, approach to setting up a blockade.

      A second order approach is to set up on a series of parallel sea lanes. This is as effective in establishing a boundary to vessels travelling in the direction of the sea lanes. This also can give you a shorter distance travel from orthogonal points to meet the point of impact without exposing your existing blockade to more encounters.

      Think of three opposing enemy convoys travelling in parallel at your blockade. If you are on the dots, the middle group is not easily reached with reinforcements. If, instead you are set up with an orthogonal sea lane just behind your blockade, you have a distance advantage for getting more units to the point of contact.

      A tertiary approach to that blockade uses High Command. Establish your submarine blockade but set all submarines at "Hold Fire". This means they will detect the enemy but not expose themselves. Now set up a secondary "linebacker" group that actually engages the enemy force. For the ultimate use of this, push your "Hold Fire" group right up to the enemy coast. You will get intel on movements in the coastal zone and potentially have a day or two of watching an invasion force be built before it ever leaves port. Perfect for making it disappear into Davy Jones' Locker.

    • High command makes subs three times as useful on average I'd estimate. Same with artillery et. al. If you are spending a significant amount of your month playing $6 is a pretty small investment. As far as the default fire at will behavior goes, yea, if subs are stationary they will fire on enemy crossing path but not otherwise, although they may get fired on. In general, it is good to keep subs in as large of stacks as possible up to 8. If enemy has lots of subs make DD. Good luck.

    • For those readers who don't know, the group of 8 rule is driven by SBDE. If you have not searched for and read, and committed to memory the article on SBDE, you are behind on your studies.

      As for keeping them in a stack or a loose association, IMHO, submarines are more valuable spread out in a line abreast or snugged up to an enemy coast. They provide wonderful intelligence, especially if HC allows you to put them in "Hold Fire" mode. Gathering them back together for an attack is just a few hours are most and while spread out, they give you lots of time to see the enemy before he knows he is dead.

      Fun fact...
      In a recent game I had the joy of watching a carrier task force be built, armed with a ground attack air wing and given a dozen ground combat units to escort. The DD escort was on it's way in from the naval yards around the corner when I pounced. It was delightful. The screams as all those ships sank into the sea. The despair of the DD commanders when they arrived to find oil slicks, dead bodies and no submarines to even attack for revenge. That is worth $6 a month, all by itself.
      In another encounter, my "Hold Fire" submarines gave intel on troop movements where no troops were supposed to be. A massive stack of troops. 60+ troops. Given that intel, I could place some spies in the right places and then use a nuke to see who is wearing sun tan lotion. Why anyone would have a stack of 60 units when the newspaper says I have nukes is beyond me.