Bomber question

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      Browsergames sind eine geniale, mehr oder weniger geschickt als Spielattrappe getarnte Geschäftsidee zum Kohleziehen :!:
      Also Vorsicht, es können überall Fußangeln, Stolperdrähte und Selbstschussanlagen lauern :00000156:
      Achtung!
      Texte oberhalb dieser Signatur können Spuren von Ironie enthalten ;)
    • TLDR short version: Aircraft units on the ground, once they are fully refueled, defend themselves at full strength.

      Aircraft units that are in the process of refueling are essentially defenseless, and each squadron has reduced hit points of no more 5 -- down from 20 (fighter squadrons), 25 (tactical bombers, naval bombers), and 30 (strategic bombers). In other words, aircraft units that are still refueling are much easier to kill.

      Please note that aircraft refueling times are tied to the level of the air base at which they are refueling. L1 air bases require 15 minutes to fully refuel all aircraft units; L2 air bases require 7.5 minutes; and L3 bases require 5 minutes. L1 air bases that are 50% complete may be used, but they require 30 minutes to refuel.
    • MontanaBB wrote:

      Please note that aircraft refueling times are tied to the level of the air base at which they are refueling. L1 air bases require 15 minutes to fully refuel all aircraft units; L2 air bases require 7.5 minutes; and L3 bases require 5 minutes. L1 air bases that are 50% complete may be used, but they require 30 minutes to refuel.
      Your a wealth of knowledge. Learned something new today! Didn't realize this. Could come in very handy.
    • MontanaBB wrote:

      Or better yet, catch the enemy aircraft units on the ground while they are refueling.
      When playing against an experienced player though, there is exactly 0% chance of doing that, because they will only use the patrol function until they have gained air superiority.

      I suppose a really experienced player might sucker another experienced player into thinking he had gained air superiority, and grow careless.
    • MartinB wrote:

      When playing against an experienced player though, there is exactly 0% chance of doing that, because they will only use the patrol function until they have gained air superiority.
      Martin, a good player is only limited by his own imagination in the number of ways to bait, trap and kill an enemy air force. Destroying or at least seriously reducing an enemy air force is always my first priority when I go to war against another human player, and there are plenty of tactics for dealing with enemy tactical bombers using patrol attacks.
    • MontanaBB wrote:

      Destroying or at least seriously reducing an enemy air force is always my first priority when I go to war against another human player...
      And so is mine. My point, which you have misread, is not that you cannot deal with enemy tacs that are using a patrol attack (of course you can), but that there is 0% chance of catching a good player's planes (whether fighters or bombers) refueling, because as long as he is using them on patrol function they will not need to refuel when they get back to base.

      You are only going to catch planes refueling when playing against a noob, or if your enemy is very very careless. I should know, because I too was a noob once, and got my planes caught while refueling, at which point I had no choice but to reluctantly concede defeat. These days, I only use the attack function when I have either already gained air superiority, or if I am operating from a base well away from an enemy's aircraft. I would think that all experienced players do the same.
    • MartinB wrote:

      . . . but that there is 0% chance of catching a good player's planes (whether fighters or bombers) refueling, because as long as he is using them on patrol function they will not need to refuel when they get back to base.
      Martin, a creative/imaginative mind is the key to great tactics. The only limits are your understanding of game dynamics and your own imagination. No way to catch them on the ground, you say? As one example, try rocketing and/or nuking their home air base below the 50% L1 threshold, wait for them to return and be converted to truck convoys, then drop another nuke on them and watch them all disappear.

      Many if not most players will also try to avoid staying on extended patrol when they know their opponent has significant air defenses, and will try to hit and kill smaller targets using hit-and-run tactics . . . I have successfully used bait-and-switch tactics against numerous "experienced"players; the key is usually presenting a weak appearance and keeping your own best assets hidden until you are ready to strike a fatal or near-fatal blow.

      A third example is forcing your opponent to refuel by making him to move his attacking bomber wing(s) more than one air base away from their present patrol zone. The aircraft must refuel at the second air base -- thus leaving them vulnerable to being punked while they are on the ground. Again, imagination and knowledge of game dynamics. And it helps, of course, if your opponent makes one or more mistakes . . . that's where the bait-and-switch often comes into play.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by MontanaBB ().

    • NukeRaider33 wrote:

      Usually, a single rocket can damage an airbase beyond use, provided that there are no other buildings in the province.
      It usually takes more than one conventional rocket to drop an L1 air base below the 50% threshold of usability, especially if there are other buildings constructed within the province which will act as damage soakers. It should also go without saying that it's going to take multiple rockets to drop an L2 or L3 air base below the L1 50% threshold.
    • MontanaBB wrote:

      No way to catch them on the ground, you say? As one example, try rocketing and/or nuking their home air base below the 50% L1 threshold, wait for them to return and be converted to truck convoys...

      And it helps, of course, if your opponent makes one or more mistakes . . .
      Again you misread my point. I did not say there is no way to catch them on the ground, I said you can't catch them refueling. As for rocketing their home base below the 50% threshold, funny you should mention that. I was playing against an "experienced" player this morning (the kind who can't stop bragging about his 21 solo victories - all on the noob 22-player map, of course) who tried to do just that. Didn't work, because I had already taken the precaution of having another airbase within range, which gave me time to fly to the alternate airbase, then off straight away out of range of his rocket attacks. So he ended up wasting God knows how many rockets destroying (or rather, damaging below the 50% mark) one lousy airbase, which I repaired for a few hundred Goods and Iron in a few hours.

      The mistake you are making is that you assume that only you are capable of creative and imaginative tactics. Yep, if you play a noob, it will feel that way. But my point was precisely that this will only work against a noob (just as if you ARE playing against a noob, you might very well catch his entire air force refueling). When playing against another experienced player (as opposed to an "experienced" player), remember that your opponent too is capable of creative and imaginative tactics (like having alternative airbases to scupper your rocketing tactics)

      So to get back to the original point, as I said in my first post, your chance of catching your enemy's planes refueling are practically zero, unless you play against a newbie, or your opponent makes a serious careless error.
    • NukeRaider33 wrote:

      Alternatively, you can just destroy the airbase, then blast the grounded aircraft of the surface of the earth. Usually, a single rocket can damage an airbase beyond use, provided that there are no other buildings...

      Again, this will only work playing against an inexperienced player. I, for one, never build airbases on empty spaces for precisely this reason. Beyond the first day or so (when it is sometimes necessary to do this e.g. when you are Russia in the historical map and you need to move your few aircraft to the schwerpunkt) my airbases are always built in cities, where there will invariably be an IC, some infrastructure, maybe even some barracks or a naval base. Takes a lot of rockets to damage that airbase beyond use, and you will probably use up more resources building all those rockets than the resources needed to replace the few planes you manage to destroy.

      Plus, any ground units you have on that spot will absorb damage. I had one fighter caught by a rocket against that "experienced" player this morning (and it was refueling!!) and it was unscathed. Just took damage to militia and the AA gun on that base.
    • MartinB wrote:

      To be fair, the majority of players you encounter are not very creative. Usually, if I don't have a challenging enemy, I tend to just drop out of the game...
      exactly my point. There are enough people who just use level one airbases on their own for me to even bother with this strategy. The majority players of this game tend to just do what is convenient for them, which can be convenient for you as well if you know how to exploit the opportunities.
      "White Fang knew the law well: To oppress the weak and obey the strong"
      Jack London, White Fang
    • MartinB wrote:

      To be fair, the majority of players you encounter are not very creative.
      Have you ever perused the list of 100,000+ players in the rankings? When we talk about the "good" players, we're only talking about a fraction of the total. And even most of the "good" players aren't particularly imaginative in their tactics. Many, if not most use brute force whenever possible, and some rely too heavily on that precious substance that shall not be named. I've never been a big fan of either.

      MartinB wrote:

      Usually, if I don't have a challenging enemy, I tend to just drop out of the game...
      I probably should do the same thing, but I have this instinctive aversion to leaving anything unfinished. It's what my father always taught his sons . . . and I can still hear my high school football coach in my head, yelling "finish the drill!"

      To keep things more interesting for me, I've gotten into the habit of taking a relatively inexperienced player under my wing in competitive games to try to teach them what I've learned about the game. Most players, however, simply don't have the patience to read the rules, understand the game dynamics, and ask questions.