Watch towers

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    • Watch towers

      How about watchtowers as a building for defense purposes(of course) and the purpose would be view range and small defenses for holding the enemies back for a moment. It will act as 1 or 2 infantry in a tower(depending on level of building mabye) and they would have binoculars to see a far range(most likely out of province depending on sizes) and see if a ship is disembarking or if units are coming your way at a greater distance then units can see or even if your neighbor is massing an invasion force. Plus if you can't afford to keep units on that province and need them more for the front lines then you can just build these real quick(i say no more then 10 hrs for level 1) and have somthing to hold the enemy back if they do decide to attack so you can have time to get your units there to counter attack or defend. This is purposed not as a main force but just as a scout for untrustworthy neighbors and to defend for a short period if needed to get reinforcments over to protect your land.
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      The post was edited 2 times, last by GenHitman ().

    • This tower sounds like it would be similar to fortifications in some way. At least if you give the land a defensive boost. If you meant having the tower also serve as units, that would destroy the barrier between units and buildings and I would suggest making it a unit only.
      Maybe you could call it "Scout". The stats would be: 1.0 for attacking & defending against infantry, 0.5 for attacking & defending against armored units, 0.5 for defense against air units, 15 HP, and a great view range for the unit to compensate for its weak battle stats. I don't think it should have any strength bonus for specific terrains, but I was considering a boosted view range for certain areas, I just figured that would be too much work to implement.
      "Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster." ~ Sun Tzu, The Art of War

      "War does not determine who is right - only who is left."
    • This is similar to something I've proposed/requested, before. But basically, you want a building that acts like a permanent garrison of an Armored Car. That is easily achieved by using an Armored Car anyway.

      A simpler suggestion is to just have an outpost building that extends view range....only. Let it be increased for higher levels (up to 3?) and make it relatively difficult to destroy by Artillery (small targets are harder to hit) so as to prevent the advantage of early warning to be negated too easily.

      This actually has sparked another idea for me, though. Perhaps there should be a new function/feature that can be done in a province. It would be employed in the same manner as constructing a building and would occupy the building process while it is done. This new feature would be to deploy landmines. Sure, they may be controversial -- now -- but so are the Nazis, etc. This is an historical game and it would be well served by having landmines.

      The effect of landmines would be to lower the speed of all units in a province by half of their then-current allowable speed. There would also be a small risk of damage to units as they are moving through the province that the mines are deployed in. Obviously, the landscape of the province would need to be altered to show that landmines are present. They would also need to be able to be cleared out by an occupying army...maybe.

      The following list of effects would apply (suggested):


      Cost to deploy:
      ..........................48 Hours
      (construction time)
      ..........................50 Manpower (duh, some humans would die by accidents when placing mines)
      ..........................2000 Goods
      ..........................1500 Metal
      ..........................100 Rare Materials
      (for the high explosive triggers?)


      Halving speed effect on unit passage -- final speed multiplier:
      Owned ....................50%
      Allied ...................40%
      Enemy ....................25%


      Cost to dismantle:

      ..........................96 Hours (difficult to find and remove)
      ..........................500 Manpower (many humans would die by accidents when removing mines)
      ..........................1500 Goods
      ..........................8000 Metal
      (lots of metal armor in landmine removers)
      It seemed like such a waste to destroy an entire battle station just to eliminate one man. But Charlie knew that it was the only way to ensure the absolute and total destruction of Quasi-duck, once and for all.

      The saying, "beating them into submission until payday", is just golden...pun intended.

      R.I.P. Snickers <3
    • If those are the stats for your mines, I think it's way too extreme. You would end up making games much longer than they are currently. Besides landmines are not related to watch towers, therefore it's off topic. In regards to making a building that solely increases view range, I like the idea, BUT with the current game mechanics it would be much easier to make a unit with a great range instead.
      "Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster." ~ Sun Tzu, The Art of War

      "War does not determine who is right - only who is left."
    • Lukenick wrote:

      Besides landmines are not related to watch towers, therefore it's off topic.

      Diabolical wrote:

      This actually has sparked another idea for me, though. Perhaps there should be a new function/feature that can be done in a province. It would be employed in the same manner as constructing a building and would occupy the building process while it is done. This new feature would be to deploy landmines.
      You see, I know it was off-topic. That wasn't the point. I said that the on-topic idea sparked a new -- different -- idea. Since the new idea was based off inspiration for the first, it is totally adequate to bring it up, here....and to flesh it out....which I did.

      Lukenick wrote:

      it would be much easier to make a unit with a great range instead.
      Actually, there already are two units that do that, the Armored Car and Naval Bomber, both of which have very large ranges. But the idea of a special building would be a permanent (and not easily-destroyed) structure which increases the range in a much more substantial way. Now, if this were a new unit type, it would add to the total number of units and there is much reluctance by Bytro to do that. Also, it would make a superviewing power mobilized which would defeat the purpose of the original structure idea which was to be purely defensive.

      Kanaris wrote:

      I like the mine idea but there needs to be some sort of a counter otherwise its OP. Maybe if you have Commandoes in your stacks they detect the mines and the speed debuff by the mines is decresed or removed?
      Actually, it does make sense, what you say. But how it's implemented must be carefully considered. For those who've played this game for more than a year or so, in addition to Naval Bombers, the Submarine (stealth) unit used to be detectable by Destroyers and other Subs. This made sense, though it made sneaking around a lot harder than it is, today. Now, by all rights, I think the Destroyer should return to having that capability since, during that era, many Destroyers were deliberately modified for that very purpose. And Submarines rely heavily on sonar to navigate, so it makes sense for them to be able to detect other Subs, too.

      Yet, for some reason, Bytro's developers prefer to leave Submarine detection solely to Naval Bombers....still. And, ironically, it makes less sense for aircraft of the era (of any kind) to be able to detect underwater units than for Destroyers of the era to do the same. So, in a way, the developers are perpetuating a false narrative that operates backwards to reality. Sound travels easier through water than through air. Sure, there were other Submarine detection practices -- perhaps, most notably, using radar at night to detect surfaced Submarines -- but they were nowhere near as useful as a well-honed surface ship's [and submerged ship's] listening staff using sonar.

      Now, to your point, mine detection was not a duty of typical commando type units. Usually, you'd have regular troops armed with metal detectors for mine-avoidance via rerouting or specialized mine-destroyers for deliberate mine detonation via various designs of heavily-shielded excavators. To me, the closest unit type to being one that could both detect mines and eliminate them would be Medium Tanks. I say this only because the body of a Medium Tank is armored enough to survive a typical anti-personnel mine which was the most common type of mine in the era.

      Now, my idea wasn't to have a mine-layer (at sea, per se) or a mine-detector. It just makes more sense -- for playability purposes -- to make it a building for the purposes of construction and deconstruction as well as makes a province distinguishable e.g., through changing the landscape to indicate the presence of mines.

      Edepedable wrote:

      I am pretty sure that watchtowers and forts or whatever were still manned by regiments to actually do the guarding and scouting. So it is already in the game. Have your regiments of infantry or armored cars or whatever airplane to stand somewhere or use their visual range.
      In a way, that isn't necessary. Obviously, Barracks are always manned by training staff. Infrastructure will be guarded by patrols and MP's. Seaports will have shore watch patrols. Military engineers and architects...as well as command staff...would be working alongside the civilians in the factories that produce the war materiel to ensure standards of military-grade weaponry is maintained. So, it makes sense that, since other buildings assume Manpower in their construction, so too would a watchtower. Thus having a unit to do the job of a building is not necessary.
      It seemed like such a waste to destroy an entire battle station just to eliminate one man. But Charlie knew that it was the only way to ensure the absolute and total destruction of Quasi-duck, once and for all.

      The saying, "beating them into submission until payday", is just golden...pun intended.

      R.I.P. Snickers <3
    • I agree with your statement regarding the stealth of submarines being ineffective against destroyers and other subs and I think the naval bombers should not be able to detect them when they're not battling. I still stand against the landmines because of the cost of implementing this idea. If you add landmines, they could slow the game down significantly and make it even harder to beat heavy gold users.
      "Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster." ~ Sun Tzu, The Art of War

      "War does not determine who is right - only who is left."
    • Lukenick wrote:

      I agree with your statement regarding the stealth of submarines being ineffective against destroyers and other subs and I think the naval bombers should not be able to detect them when they're not battling. I still stand against the landmines because of the cost of implementing this idea. If you add landmines, they could slow the game down significantly and make it even harder to beat heavy gold users.
      Actually, the game is necessarily slow, already. A typical large match can last months...and often does. The slowing of transit via mining the landscape would not make much of a difference in the long-run as people often set units to march and then leave the game for awhile....meanwhile, their units reach the target and then sit for awhile because the player hasn't returned yet and sometimes doesn't for a long time.

      As for beating heavy gold users, I would think the opposite is true, that having landmines would slow down the tank-rush and armored car rush that some heavy golders attempt. That would buy you the time to rally your forces and those of your neighbors and allies to intercept the gold-bought forces of the enemy.
      It seemed like such a waste to destroy an entire battle station just to eliminate one man. But Charlie knew that it was the only way to ensure the absolute and total destruction of Quasi-duck, once and for all.

      The saying, "beating them into submission until payday", is just golden...pun intended.

      R.I.P. Snickers <3
    • my intentions was for this to be just a watchtower to have minimal defenses so it holds the enemy for 1 attack cycle to delay the enemy in time for you to get troops over and counter attack. It is ment for just being there in place of units so you do not have to have a unit siting there the whole time for the chance of someone turning against you. and i said 1 or 2 infantry to create the stats for the tower so its simple. if there are levels then that can be how many infantry are in the tower to defend and mabye increase view range a little more each time(not to confuse creating infantry and combining them manualy). if anything to limit the amount to build so you dont spam on every province, you can only place on boarder lines and not in centralized provinces. if you push the boarder then the towers would get destroyed automaticly and you would have to manualy place them again. Im not trying to make this OP just defensive to watch your six while you focus troops in other places.

      :thumbsup:
      Please and Thanks! :thumbsup:
      Consider a like to this post!
    • I mean, I don't see a problem with one having a watchtower in other provinces, unless it's decided that they have a defensive presence, because in one case it's useless, and the other it could be used as additional units.

      Hey, if you can add the cost of the infantry (or whatever unit you want defending it), and the upkeep cost is added to the tower, I would be fine with it. My main concern is the game mechanics and it just doesn't seem workable.
      Maybe you could ask for a feature that would lock a unit in a province (tied to the buildings within the province) and that would allow the same effect.

      Even if these buildings are only allowed on the border of your nation, why would you not have troops there? Wouldn't that just be leaving yourself wide open for your opponent? I think if you are caught without defense on your border you should not be helped by some building like that in a defensive stance. After all, you would be able to tell the unit is incoming much earlier.
      "Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster." ~ Sun Tzu, The Art of War

      "War does not determine who is right - only who is left."
    • Why not just use the already existing guards and watch-towers (= units + fortifications) as all experienced players do? >> the units remain mobile and the fortifications are needed anyway for the moral.. -- ..instead of wasting resources on stationary buildings, which are mostly only needed temporarily because the front is constantly changing and maybe tomorrow is completely elsewhere ..

      Browser games are an ingenious business idea to lure out money -
      - more or less cleverly camouflaged as a real game sometimes.
      So beware of caltrops, spring-guns and booby traps. :00008185:
      Warning! Texts above this signature may contain traces of irony! :whistling:
    • Ah, but some should be implemented. I've always liked the idea of a watchtower or lookout post. It's only a minor building enhancement but would serve a special purpose to extend visual range. This would enhance ranged (artillery) bombardment (by being able to see the target)....especially for RR Guns. This would also enable earlier detection of incoming invasions.

      Sure, it may be not-mobile, but so what? Suppose you actually don't lose a province with a watchtower in it, yet you do lose a province even closer to your core. Unless and until that watchtower falls, you will still get visibility of what your enemy is doing and be able -- maybe -- to execute a more thought-out counter strike based in part on better knowledge of the opposition you face because that watchtower still stands.

      I'll state it again....I like the watchtower building idea.
      It seemed like such a waste to destroy an entire battle station just to eliminate one man. But Charlie knew that it was the only way to ensure the absolute and total destruction of Quasi-duck, once and for all.

      The saying, "beating them into submission until payday", is just golden...pun intended.

      R.I.P. Snickers <3
    • Restrisiko wrote:

      Why not just use the already existing guards and watch-towers (= units + fortifications) as all experienced players do? >> the units remain mobile and the fortifications are needed anyway for the moral.. -- ..instead of wasting resources on stationary buildings, which are mostly only needed temporarily because the front is constantly changing and maybe tomorrow is completely elsewhere ..
      you clearly did not understand my point. fortifications take forever to build up and is not ideal for start of game. Im suggesting somthing for the start of the game(or even useful later as well) thats cheap afordable and useful to watch your six, while you choose to attack one person your boarders have a watchful eye on the other potentialy 5 people on your boarder lines so you do not need to expend troops to watch your lines and have them focus on the war you are in. Plus the bigger focus of watchtowers im trying to get at here is view range so it has an advantage over regualr troops you have placed. While your enemy has troops waiting on their lines ready to attack you, You have your tower already seeing what they are planing while their troops cant see because of the view range therefore you can plan ahead for a "surprise" invasion. Hope this again can clear things up
      Please and Thanks! :thumbsup:
      Consider a like to this post!

      The post was edited 2 times, last by GenHitman ().

    • GenHitman wrote:

      Restrisiko wrote:

      Why not just use the already existing guards and watch-towers (= units + fortifications) as all experienced players do? >> the units remain mobile and the fortifications are needed anyway for the moral.. -- ..instead of wasting resources on stationary buildings, which are mostly only needed temporarily because the front is constantly changing and maybe tomorrow is completely elsewhere ..
      you clearly did not understand my point. fortifications take forever to build up and is not ideal for start of game. Im suggesting somthing for the start of the game(or even useful later as well) thats cheap afordable and useful to watch your six, while you choose to attack one person your boarders have a watchful eye on the other potentialy 5 people on your boarder lines so you do not need to expend troops to watch your lines and have them focus on the war you are in. Plus the bigger focus of watchtowers im trying to get at here is view range so it has an advantage over regualr troops you have placed. While your enemy has troops waiting on their lines ready to attack you, You have your tower already seeing what they are planing while their troops cant see because of the view range therefore you can plan ahead for a "surprise" invasion. Hope this again can clear things up

      GenHitman wrote:

      How about watchtowers ...


      .. It will act as 1 or 2 infantry in a tower(depending on level of building mabye) and they would have binoculars to see a far range(most likely out of province depending on sizes) and see if a ship is disembarking or if units are coming your way at a greater distance then units can see ..


      .. /..


      .. if you can't afford to keep units on that province and need them more for the front lines then you can just build these real quick(i say about 30 mins for level 1) and have somthing to hold the enemy back ..

      Aah, now I have it I think -- so, you want something stationary that is equal to the value and the ability of at least 1 infantry and 1 reconnaissance plane -- but, with of course significantly lower production costs than, for example, a single militia or an AT, without daily resource consumption and furthermore within half an hour producible..?
      Yep, what a magical dream ..

      Browser games are an ingenious business idea to lure out money -
      - more or less cleverly camouflaged as a real game sometimes.
      So beware of caltrops, spring-guns and booby traps. :00008185:
      Warning! Texts above this signature may contain traces of irony! :whistling:
    • Restrisiko wrote:

      GenHitman wrote:

      Restrisiko wrote:

      Why not just use the already existing guards and watch-towers (= units + fortifications) as all experienced players do? >> the units remain mobile and the fortifications are needed anyway for the moral.. -- ..instead of wasting resources on stationary buildings, which are mostly only needed temporarily because the front is constantly changing and maybe tomorrow is completely elsewhere ..
      you clearly did not understand my point. fortifications take forever to build up and is not ideal for start of game. Im suggesting somthing for the start of the game(or even useful later as well) thats cheap afordable and useful to watch your six, while you choose to attack one person your boarders have a watchful eye on the other potentialy 5 people on your boarder lines so you do not need to expend troops to watch your lines and have them focus on the war you are in. Plus the bigger focus of watchtowers im trying to get at here is view range so it has an advantage over regualr troops you have placed. While your enemy has troops waiting on their lines ready to attack you, You have your tower already seeing what they are planing while their troops cant see because of the view range therefore you can plan ahead for a "surprise" invasion. Hope this again can clear things up

      GenHitman wrote:

      How about watchtowers ...


      .. It will act as 1 or 2 infantry in a tower(depending on level of building mabye) and they would have binoculars to see a far range(most likely out of province depending on sizes) and see if a ship is disembarking or if units are coming your way at a greater distance then units can see ..


      .. /..


      .. if you can't afford to keep units on that province and need them more for the front lines then you can just build these real quick(i say about 30 mins for level 1) and have somthing to hold the enemy back ..
      Aah, now I have it I think -- so, you want something stationary that is equal to the value and the ability of at least 1 infantry and 1 reconnaissance plane -- but, with of course significantly lower production costs than, for example, a single militia or an AT, without daily resource consumption and furthermore within half an hour producible..?
      Yep, what a magical dream ..
      One usually starts with 4 or 5 factories, based on the map. So they can only build a few units at a time. But, in theory, one can build many buildings at once, one per province. Of course, there are idio.ts who will put a barracks in every province, killing their food, right off the bat, but at least that's their right to do so. This guy's idea is to allow one to choose to build a building that sorta acts like an infantry and fighter and armored car, but can't move. If they were building those units, they'd have nothing else. But if they can build a building (and it should take a lot longer than a half hour to do so) in a province, then their factories can build war machines instead of "mobile" lookout posts.
      It seemed like such a waste to destroy an entire battle station just to eliminate one man. But Charlie knew that it was the only way to ensure the absolute and total destruction of Quasi-duck, once and for all.

      The saying, "beating them into submission until payday", is just golden...pun intended.

      R.I.P. Snickers <3

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Diabolical ().

    • Restrisiko wrote:

      Aah, now I have it I think -- so, you want something stationary that is equal to the value and the ability of at least 1 infantry and 1 reconnaissance plane -- but, with of course significantly lower production costs than, for example, a single militia or an AT, without daily resource consumption and furthermore within half an hour producible..?
      Yep, what a magical dream ..
      sigh.. its a building, never said it wouldnt have upkeep just said its the basic stats as 1 infantry, its purpose is to view father then any unit to see your neighbors close province and determine if they are planing a mass invasion off your boarder while all your units are off in a war with another person on the other side of your boarders. as well as provide basic small protection for your province to delay the enemy for you to have time to provide reinforcments over there to counter attack before they capture your province. And you can only place them on boarder lines not on every province like any other building to prevent spam and building time is just a filler it can change depending on balance and what the devs would like better. This is basic stuff if you cannot understand the basic logic im explaining thats a you problem.
      Please and Thanks! :thumbsup:
      Consider a like to this post!