Option to sabotage your own structures

Vlanchavic · May 28th 2019, 2:12am

I was wondering if there could be an option in the future to sabotage/destroy your structures. In my current game my coalition member decided to turn on me while I moved most of my troops out of the country and I have a lot of maxed out provinces that I wished I could completely demolish so he wouldn’t be able to use them

Lukenick · May 28th 2019, 6:06am

I think if there was this option that it should require some amount of time (it gradually decreases over time not demolished immediately). It might be much easier to destroy than build, but it should not be done in under an hour. I suggest that an industrial complex at level 5 takes 20 hours to demolish, 16 hrs at level 4, 12 hrs at level 3 and so on. While it is definitely possible for one to destroy a building quickly, for the purpose of the game, we need to allow for some time to rethink your choices regarding the matter.

But in the end, it should be an option available to you. It might take time and resources just like It would if you built it, but available nonetheless.

General Nightman · May 28th 2019, 6:21am

While the idea is appealing, I don't believe that it will ever be implemented.
It would effect the entire game structure.
If you can't get more production centers, you can't expand.

BMfox · May 28th 2019, 7:36am

General Nightman wrote:

While the idea is appealing, I don't believe that it will ever be implemented.
It would effect the entire game structure.
If you can't get more production centers, you can't expand.

You have just answered your own question. It would be abused and every player would demolish his buildings when he's losing. This way it's harder to expand and the games would strech on forever.

Marcos Sicilia · May 28th 2019, 7:53pm

BMfox wrote:

General Nightman wrote:

While the idea is appealing, I don't believe that it will ever be implemented.
It would effect the entire game structure.
If you can't get more production centers, you can't expand.

You have just answered your own question. It would be abused and every player would demolish his buildings when he's losing. This way it's harder to expand and the games would strech on forever.

If you fear an eternal game with demolishing everywhere, the solution could be a limit, maybe per day or user, like when you buy/sell one province or troop to other player. But this second have a full limit, when the other player have to sell or buy to you. So not is a bad idea at all...

An in other way, if we want to do a real history condition, remember when the URSS destroy the oil wells in the Caucasus, or when the wihdrawal of the German troops they destroy the bridges and roads to block the SOviet advance...

BMfox · May 28th 2019, 8:30pm

As much as your historical facts might be correct this is a game. There are no rivers, no bridges and by burning all the fields my troops won't get hungry or freeze to death because they don't have shelter, they'll just continue marching. When players have the option to destroy their buildings then players who are bad at losing will do so. There's already enough players that don't upgrade their Industrial Complexes so everything gets destroyed. Some games can already last forever. There's no need to make a step backwards and make it worse.

Marcos Sicilia · May 28th 2019, 8:37pm

This is why i think in the existence of a limit. The loser couldn't destroy all his country only because he is missing the game.

Maybe one thing good of this is when the players or the AI's build infraestructure in provinces that not have an important meaning being strategic or productive. In this case the new owner of this territories could destroy the industry or most common, the naval bases, taking (I dont know how), some of the materials used to build that building... long live the redundancy xD

BMfox · May 28th 2019, 11:09pm

Or you just switch the naval base off

Lukenick · May 29th 2019, 12:20am

Marcos Sicilia wrote:

Maybe one thing good of this is when the players or the AI's build infraestructure in provinces that not have an important meaning being strategic or productive. In this case the new owner of this territories could destroy the industry or most common, the naval bases, taking (I dont know how), some of the materials used to build that building... long live the redundancy xD

I am not a supporter of gaining ANY resources through the demolition process. It should NEVER help you directly, its intent is to hurt your attacker (and yes you would be an indirect beneficiary).

BMfox wrote:

Some games can already last forever. There's no need to make a step backwards and make it worse.

If an attacker is dependent upon the infrastructure of his newly invaded provinces, he has not properly prepared himself to invade that land. This would definitely make sudden gains of land much more difficult and increase the importance of your core economy.

Marcos Sicilia wrote:

This is why i think in the existence of a limit.

I do believe there should be some sort of limit on this to prevent an exhaustive amount of destruction. Maybe limit it to a player can only destroy 5 buildings a day? This means they could completely demolish 5 level 5 industrial complexes if they wish all in one day. On top of that, it should definitely damage their profile's economic stats, or maybe just subtract the destroyed buildings from the number of buildings built (you demolish 13 infrastructure leads to subtracting 13 from the built infrastructure in your profile).

General Nightman · May 29th 2019, 5:01am

A true player could use that to his advantage anways.
Sabotage the high level airports, infrastructure, nuclear reactors, and we'd be set back for days, regardless of the limit.

Lukenick wrote:

I do believe there should be some sort of limit on this to prevent an exhaustive amount of destruction. Maybe limit it to a player can only destroy 5 buildings a day? This means they could completely demolish 5 level 5 industrial complexes if they wish all in one day

You do realize that is an entire countries worth of IC's, right?

Lukenick wrote:

If an attacker is dependent upon the infrastructure of his newly invaded provinces, he has not properly prepared himself to invade that land. This would definitely make sudden gains of land much more difficult and increase the importance of your core economy.

I would love to see you fight a war with only troops from your core provinces when you are 4 days from home.

Lukenick · May 29th 2019, 9:03pm

In response to the first part, it would only be all their buildings provided they built nothing else on top of that or conquered more land and built/gained a new one.
For the second part, I don't fight with units solely from my core. I often find myself needing to build new IC from scratch to make up for the limited IC I have even with expansion. And if I do have to build them from scratch, I place them in my core resource provinces first. By the time I travel that far, I would have built a good number of ICs from scratch and boosted my resource production in the process with them.

Maybe we should make it cost 20-100 gold to demolish 1 bldg (varies by bldg and level).

Marcos Sicilia · May 30th 2019, 8:20pm

BMfox wrote:

Or you just switch the naval base off

Damn it, well done master, well done... xD

Marcos Sicilia · May 30th 2019, 8:26pm

General Nightman wrote:

A true player could use that to his advantage anways.
Sabotage the high level airports, infrastructure, nuclear reactors, and we'd be set back for days, regardless of the limit.

Lukenick wrote:

I do believe there should be some sort of limit on this to prevent an exhaustive amount of destruction. Maybe limit it to a player can only destroy 5 buildings a day? This means they could completely demolish 5 level 5 industrial complexes if they wish all in one day

You do realize that is an entire countries worth of IC's, right?

Lukenick wrote:

If an attacker is dependent upon the infrastructure of his newly invaded provinces, he has not properly prepared himself to invade that land. This would definitely make sudden gains of land much more difficult and increase the importance of your core economy.

I would love to see you fight a war with only troops from your core provinces when you are 4 days from home.

Anyway, I think that recycling the industry that you dont gonna used, or the buildings that you dont gonna repair, is better gain something discarding them, than have whatever the enemy land had without order. More when you cant inmediately redo that buildings benefiting you. Always this with a limit of course, and the idea of only 5,is not bad.

BMfox · May 30th 2019, 9:20pm

Lukenick wrote:

If an attacker is dependent upon the infrastructure of his newly invaded provinces, he has not properly prepared himself to invade that land. This would definitely make sudden gains of land much more difficult and increase the importance of your core economy.

If you are 3 days away from your capitol and you take over an IC level 4 and infra level 2 you repair it and train troops there. It's more efficient then to train troops in your cores and send them on a march for 3 days. You train your units as close to the front as possible. Your cores are producing planes as those are faster to fill the gap.

MYSTIC_FOX · May 30th 2019, 9:51pm

I posted an idea similar to this. However, instead of a function key, it would be the addition of an "Engineer" unit. They would fight like militia, but have the ability to take out structures like artillery. So it would take time to destroy built up infrastructure, but it would be possible. It would also offer a movement penalty for any unit moving through the territory until everything was repaired. This would equate the real use of engineers to blow bridges, place mines, and construct barriers.

VorlonFCW · May 31st 2019, 1:52pm

Just build some rockets and hit it once the enemy takes it, or sabotage with spies as mentioned above.

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