Aviation tree redo

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    • Aviation tree redo

      As I was reading the threads for the CoW 1.5 updates, I couldn't help but notice that there were relatively few mentioned changes to aviation units compared to other units.

      I'm bothered by the current lack of variety compared to other trees, especially the armor tree. Air power has been seen as the key to victory since WWII, so it only makes sense that players have to choose to research the best planes for their tactics. The average non-gold using player can't easily research all of the tank-tree and keep their research up to date. They are forced to choose the units that best fit their strategy. On the other hand, it is relatively easy for the same player to research the entire aviation tree and keep up to date, while also focusing on the other trees. I propose a redo of the aviation tree to give players more variety and force them to make tactical decisions.

      The following units would be in the new tree:

      Fighter - Like the current Interceptor, this unit's main purpose would be to combat enemy planes. They would be fast but lack range, strong against aircraft, and weak against everything else. There would be five levels, but no elite level, the first available from day 1. All levels would be carrier based.

      Jet Fighter - Technically a continuation of the Fighter line, the Jet Fighter would be faster and have a longer range to escort later-level bombers. There would be two levels, the second being elite, with the first requiring Fighter level 5 to be researched. This unit would not be carrier-based, meaning regular fighters would still need to be producible for naval air power.

      Rocket Fighter - Equivalent to the current Rocket Fighter. The strongest and fastest fighter-type aircraft, but with the shortest range. There would be two levels, the first requiring Fighter level 3 to be researched. It would not be carrier based.

      Heavy Fighter - This fighter variant would be primarily offensive against planes, but would do okay in defense against small numbers of regular fighters. It would also do above average damage against infantry, tanks, and ships for a fighter, but not as much as the Medium Bomber. It would have the longest range for a fighter but the slowest speed, both probably comparable to the Medium Bomber. There would be 5 levels including an elite, the first requiring Fighter level 2 to be researched. Level 3 and above would be carrier based.

      Light Bomber - This unit would have speed and range similar to the Fighter, but would be strong against infantry, tanks, and ships, but weak against planes and submarines. There would be seven levels including an elite level, the first available from day 1. All levels would be carrier based.

      Medium Bomber - Intended to bridge the gap between the Light Bomber and Heavy Bomber, this unit does not excel against anything, but is decent against infantry, tanks, cities, and ships. Like the Light and Heavy Bombers, the Medium Bomber would be weak against planes and submarines, and slower than the Light Bomber, but have a longer range. It would have six levels, including an elite, the first available on day 2 and requiring Light Bomber level 1 to be researched. Level 3 onward would be carrier based.

      Heavy Bomber - The largest and hardest hitting of the bombers, this unit would excel at bombing cities, but would be weak against everything else. It would have the longest range of any plane, but would also be the slowest. There would be 5 levels, including an elite, the first available from day 4 and requiring Medium Bomber level 2 to be researched. This unit would not be carrier based.

      Anti Sub Warfare (ASW) Bomber - Like the current Naval Bomber, this unit's main purpose would be to reveal and attack submarines. It would be strong against subs and decent against ships, but weak against everything else. There would be seven levels, including an elite, the first available from day 1 and requiring Light Bomber level 1 ro be researched. This unit would be carrier based.

      Nuclear Bomber - Same as now.

      Paratroopers - Same as now.
      FORUM GANG Big Shot Executive

      Yes, I'm that guy with the big office on the top floor of the Forum Gang tower.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by thunderdog1138 ().

    • Heavy fighter should be a more expensive light bomber, same ground attack capabilities but has poor defence against planes, maybe a little less than a light bomber. They only have one gunner and still turn slow. A bomber has a few gunners, but turns slower and isn't as fast.

      This is a fantastic idea in my opinion.
      :00000441: Forum Gang Commissar :00000441:

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    • How about the nuclear bomber is scrapped and instead atomic bomb functions are expanded. Because then the player has a choice of how to use the nuke after it's produced. There can be 3 ways to use the same atomic bomb. Use it as is with the heavy bomber. If used with level 1 - 3 heavy bomber, then they are destroyed after it's dropped and so are any escorting aircraft, except jet fighters. Level 4 - 5 heavy bombers are not destroyed after dropping the nuke, and can be reused for conventional load or another nuke. The bombers can obviously be shot down by AAs and enemy planes, so they need escort to increase the chances of reaching the target.

      The second way to use the atomic bomb is to convert it into a warhead for the missile (and can be reversed into a nuke from a warhead, with time, money and manpower as cost), to be used offensively or defensively (ABM). Converting the atomic bomb into the warhead takes time, money and manpower not rare material as the atomic bomb is already made, and the missile can be level 2 - 4 (Maybe add Elite level 5) with the difference being range, while they all deal the same damage as it is the same level warhead being used. The missiles can't be shot down by the AA or any plane, except for an anti-ballistic missile (ABM) system. Before being produced the the player has to choose its use, i.e. offensive or defensive (ABM), the missile's function can be switched around but it takes time and manpower to do so (during which it is vulnerable to attacks and be used until the conversion is completed, canceling the conversion won't be instant and will take time already take + penal to revert), hence the player has to be careful when producing the nuclear missile in the first place. To make it simple, any warhead level ABM will take out any warhead level nuclear missile if its within the defended radius, the missile level doesn't matter during the interception as it only affects the range and speed during the attack/defence (It can be expanded a bit more, i.e. the missile and warhead level significance during interception would make sense if the intercepted missile does damage to the city/units, so the earlier/farther away it is intercepted the better, which is why ABM radar system should also be added to the game in that case. The ABM radar system (with has different multiple levels) will allow for missiles to be intercepted farther away from the city/province, the missile level will hence determine how fast it can reach it (i.e. the faster the better), and the combined warhead level determines the damage to the buildings and units. So the levels hence determine if the buildings and units get damaged and if they do then by how much).

      And finally an atomic bomb can be used as weapon of last resort on the surface, i.e. kamikaze by blowing up the city/province with or without the enemy troops, either to destroy all infrastructure (scorched earth policy) and/or enemy units. The bomb can be moved around on land/sea/air, hence it can be captured by the enemy and detonated at the sea as convoy, destroying fleets and city if close enough.

      What do you think? I know it's a lot and complex, (and this isn't even comprehensive at all) but it makes sense since it's realistic, and it's unfair how nothing can be done about incoming nuclear missiles.
      Forum Gang Sergeant Major

      Hanz Gunvor

      Ace of Spades - Unit IV Alliance Leader
    • Quasi-duck wrote:

      Heavy fighter should be a more expensive light bomber, same ground attack capabilities but has poor defence against planes, maybe a little less than a light bomber. They only have one gunner and still turn slow. A bomber has a few gunners, but turns slower and isn't as fast.

      This is a fantastic idea in my opinion.
      I don't like the idea of any unit being a "slightly better" or "more expensive" unit than another. We currently have this with the Militia/Infantry and Armored Car/Light Tank.

      My idea is that Fighters would be primarily for defending against bombers and escorting bombers to their targets. Heavy Fighters, on the other hand, would be like slower fighters with a few bombs strapped to their wings. They would not do as much damage as Light Bombers, but would not need to be escorted to get through a Fighter Patrol. If someone wanted to do real damage, they would have to invest in a good bomber and fighter escorts.
      FORUM GANG Big Shot Executive

      Yes, I'm that guy with the big office on the top floor of the Forum Gang tower.

    • Hanz Gunther wrote:

      How about the nuclear bomber is scrapped and instead atomic bomb functions are expanded. Because then the player has a choice of how to use the nuke after it's produced. There can be 3 ways to use the same atomic bomb. Use it as is with the heavy bomber. If used with level 1 - 3 heavy bomber, then they are destroyed after it's dropped and so are any escorting aircraft, except jet fighters. Level 4 - 5 heavy bombers are not destroyed after dropping the nuke, and can be reused for conventional load or another nuke. The bombers can obviously be shot down by AAs and enemy planes, so they need escort to increase the chances of reaching the target.

      The second way to use the atomic bomb is to convert it into a warhead for the missile (and can be reversed into a nuke from a warhead, with time, money and manpower as cost), to be used offensively or defensively (ABM). Converting the atomic bomb into the warhead takes time, money and manpower not rare material as the atomic bomb is already made, and the missile can be level 2 - 4 (Maybe add Elite level 5) with the difference being range, while they all deal the same damage as it is the same level warhead being used. The missiles can't be shot down by the AA or any plane, except for an anti-ballistic missile (ABM) system. Before being produced the the player has to choose its use, i.e. offensive or defensive (ABM), the missile's function can be switched around but it takes time and manpower to do so (during which it is vulnerable to attacks and be used until the conversion is completed, canceling the conversion won't be instant and will take time already take + penal to revert), hence the player has to be careful when producing the nuclear missile in the first place. To make it simple, any warhead level ABM will take out any warhead level nuclear missile if its within the defended radius, the missile level doesn't matter during the interception as it only affects the range and speed during the attack/defence (It can be expanded a bit more, i.e. the missile and warhead level significance during interception would make sense if the intercepted missile does damage to the city/units, so the earlier/farther away it is intercepted the better, which is why ABM radar system should also be added to the game in that case. The ABM radar system (with has different multiple levels) will allow for missiles to be intercepted farther away from the city/province, the missile level will hence determine how fast it can reach it (i.e. the faster the better), and the combined warhead level determines the damage to the buildings and units. So the levels hence determine if the buildings and units get damaged and if they do then by how much).

      And finally an atomic bomb can be used as weapon of last resort on the surface, i.e. kamikaze by blowing up the city/province with or without the enemy troops, either to destroy all infrastructure (scorched earth policy) and/or enemy units. The bomb can be moved around on land/sea/air, hence it can be captured by the enemy and detonated at the sea as convoy, destroying fleets and city if close enough.

      What do you think? I know it's a lot and complex, (and this isn't even comprehensive at all) but it makes sense since it's realistic, and it's unfair how nothing can be done about incoming nuclear missiles.
      Those are some great ideas, but you might want to start a new thread for them. This thread is about replacing the current aviation tree with a new one. Your idea would work even if the tech tree is not changed.
      FORUM GANG Big Shot Executive

      Yes, I'm that guy with the big office on the top floor of the Forum Gang tower.

    • thunderdog1138 wrote:

      Hanz Gunther wrote:

      How about the nuclear bomber is scrapped and instead atomic bomb functions are expanded. Because then the player has a choice of how to use the nuke after it's produced. There can be 3 ways to use the same atomic bomb. Use it as is with the heavy bomber. If used with level 1 - 3 heavy bomber, then they are destroyed after it's dropped and so are any escorting aircraft, except jet fighters. Level 4 - 5 heavy bombers are not destroyed after dropping the nuke, and can be reused for conventional load or another nuke. The bombers can obviously be shot down by AAs and enemy planes, so they need escort to increase the chances of reaching the target.

      The second way to use the atomic bomb is to convert it into a warhead for the missile (and can be reversed into a nuke from a warhead, with time, money and manpower as cost), to be used offensively or defensively (ABM). Converting the atomic bomb into the warhead takes time, money and manpower not rare material as the atomic bomb is already made, and the missile can be level 2 - 4 (Maybe add Elite level 5) with the difference being range, while they all deal the same damage as it is the same level warhead being used. The missiles can't be shot down by the AA or any plane, except for an anti-ballistic missile (ABM) system. Before being produced the the player has to choose its use, i.e. offensive or defensive (ABM), the missile's function can be switched around but it takes time and manpower to do so (during which it is vulnerable to attacks and be used until the conversion is completed, canceling the conversion won't be instant and will take time already take + penal to revert), hence the player has to be careful when producing the nuclear missile in the first place. To make it simple, any warhead level ABM will take out any warhead level nuclear missile if its within the defended radius, the missile level doesn't matter during the interception as it only affects the range and speed during the attack/defence (It can be expanded a bit more, i.e. the missile and warhead level significance during interception would make sense if the intercepted missile does damage to the city/units, so the earlier/farther away it is intercepted the better, which is why ABM radar system should also be added to the game in that case. The ABM radar system (with has different multiple levels) will allow for missiles to be intercepted farther away from the city/province, the missile level will hence determine how fast it can reach it (i.e. the faster the better), and the combined warhead level determines the damage to the buildings and units. So the levels hence determine if the buildings and units get damaged and if they do then by how much).

      And finally an atomic bomb can be used as weapon of last resort on the surface, i.e. kamikaze by blowing up the city/province with or without the enemy troops, either to destroy all infrastructure (scorched earth policy) and/or enemy units. The bomb can be moved around on land/sea/air, hence it can be captured by the enemy and detonated at the sea as convoy, destroying fleets and city if close enough.

      What do you think? I know it's a lot and complex, (and this isn't even comprehensive at all) but it makes sense since it's realistic, and it's unfair how nothing can be done about incoming nuclear missiles.
      Those are some great ideas, but you might want to start a new thread for them. This thread is about replacing the current aviation tree with a new one. Your idea would work even if the tech tree is not changed.
      That's what I thought halfway through writing this
      Forum Gang Sergeant Major

      Hanz Gunvor

      Ace of Spades - Unit IV Alliance Leader
    • Strategic bombers should not be stackable with other aircrafts exept Atom bombers and, if implemented, long range escort fighters.
      Atom bombers, strat. bombers and longrangeescort fighters should not have patrol ability. (atom bombers havent already).
      Escortfighter and strat. b. should have same or reversed airattack defence stats.
      Longrangeescort fighters should be stackeble only with strat. b. and atom. b...

      LRE fighters should not have destealth ability.

      I would glad remove carrier landing ability for lvl4 and above tac. Bombers, since they are too heavy. Lvl. 5 and above naval bombers. And lvl6 and above fighters.

      Adding carrier ability to lvl 1 rocketfighters, lvl 1 paratroopers, flying bomb or maybe strat. Lvl. 1 and LRE fighter lvl1.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Last Warrior ().