Morale is still an issue

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    • Thank you Z00mZ00m - you seem to be the only person on this post that understands the actual issue here!

      Sure it is possible to send a troop round the map recapping provinces that revolt... but I shouldn't have to do that, and I don't want to have to do that.

      The simple fact is, that you can hit a certain point in the game where the morale system is no longer manageable and is fundamentally flawed - that's what I want the devs to look into

      Freezy dude where you at? This post has been up for ages...
    • You don't need to actually build prop offices. Keep 2 militia... Maybe 3 in cities or strategically important places. Once if a rebellion causes loss of provinces, just recapture them and put the units previously placed in low morale places. Take down capitals of ai nations. If u are mexico, simple efforts can help u increase ur morale to 100%
    • RBoi200 wrote:

      What I don't understand is WHY you have morale problems... if you play right, you shouldn't.
      Clearly you've never had a very large empire if that is your view.

      Look at this:
      gyazo.com/f91b4208bf7bfcfc4371287f69e75d16

      The reason WHY is basic math...I've explained it twice already in detail.. but here we go again..

      You have a morale bar as a percentage up to 100%.
      As you expand, you get an expansion penalty of up to -30%
      You also have a distance to capital penalty of up to -30%
      @Andromeda, that is not helpful - if I move capital from A to B, then A has the penalty (which means my cores have the penalty, and my overall production would be significantly worse overall, bad advice) - there is no "middle" because my empire is so vast, that if I moved it to the middle i.e. A is one end, B middle, C other end, the distance from A to B and C to B is still the largest penalty.

      100% - 30% - 30% = 40%

      Rboi, this means the maximum morale any of my empire can have (past the point these penalties are both -30) is 40% morale.

      When a province has 40% morale, it promotes a "-6%" to all of its neighbours.
      Provinces have on average 4-5 neighbours.
      This means all my provinces have, on average, another -24% to -30% Neighbour penalty.
      100% -30% -30% -30% = 10%

      This means the "Target Morale" for all my provinces is 10% morale, so the morale is always falling, see below:
      gyazo.com/eebcc927e39550ec4914640633f154b8

      On the pic above, you can see I have penalties of
      -30% Distance to capital
      -28% Expansion
      -36% neighbour
      Target Morale = 100% -30% -36% -28% = 6%

      I also have a propaganda office going to level 2 in this province, so I have approximately +12% boost.
      6% + 12% = 18%.
      As you can see in the pic, the morale is 17% (close enough to 18% given the approximations)

      That is why the "TREND" is "STABLE"
      The issue is the "Chance of Uprising" i.e. the chance it will revolt.

      In the first picture, you can clearly see all of the bright red provinces in my empire. That's approximately 400 provinces. This means on the next day change, I could have 400 provinces revolt.

      It has taken 20 days to accumulate them all, I cannot simply "go round recapturing them" in 1 day again before the next day change.
      I also cannot afford to spare 400 militia to sit in them all. (or, 800-1200 potentially)

      If anyone does not understand the issue here, please read all 3 of my posts over and over until you do, because mathematically it is a huge issue for players who make it to the endgame. (Also, country has a large impact. If I was e.g. Kazakhstan, then I might be okay because my overall distance to capital and length of empire would be smaller. But as New South Wales, it means my empire is extremely long due to its natural placement)
    • ryanb96 wrote:

      RBoi200 wrote:

      What I don't understand is WHY you have morale problems... if you play right, you shouldn't.
      Clearly you've never had a very large empire if that is your view.
      (Also, country has a large impact. If I was e.g. Kazakhstan, then I might be okay because my overall distance to capital and length of empire would be smaller. But as New South Wales, it means my empire is extremely long due to its natural placement)
      Heck I have managed large empires and never had ANY sort of the problem you described, as many people on this thread have said. So I'm afraid, and I'm really sorry for being the one to break this to you, that it is something YOU are doing wrong. I still think it is in capital management (doing this correctly will mitigate neighbor effects as well), but the issue me and others have raised, as you do here yourself now as well, is that your own capital is too remote. You ARE aware that you can move it, and "be like Kazakhstan" as well, right? Why do you insist on keeping your capital in that remote place, if it might help solve your problem?
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.
    • K.Rokossovski wrote:

      ryanb96 wrote:

      RBoi200 wrote:

      What I don't understand is WHY you have morale problems... if you play right, you shouldn't.
      Clearly you've never had a very large empire if that is your view.(Also, country has a large impact. If I was e.g. Kazakhstan, then I might be okay because my overall distance to capital and length of empire would be smaller. But as New South Wales, it means my empire is extremely long due to its natural placement)
      Heck I have managed large empires and never had ANY sort of the problem you described, as many people on this thread have said. So I'm afraid, and I'm really sorry for being the one to break this to you, that it is something YOU are doing wrong. I still think it is in capital management (doing this correctly will mitigate neighbor effects as well), but the issue me and others have raised, as you do here yourself now as well, is that your own capital is too remote. You ARE aware that you can move it, and "be like Kazakhstan" as well, right? Why do you insist on keeping your capital in that remote place, if it might help solve your problem?
      Like I explained, this will not solve the issue - and quite frankly will be extremely counter productive.

      Look:
      My Capital is in New South Wales.
      By the time I reach IndoChina, my distance to capital penalty is already at -30.

      gyazo.com/0ecd5f09cd0282450b53f36c8f41d875

      So YES, I COULD move my capital here. BUT if I did this, then all of my CORE provinces would sink to 10-20% morale due to the penalty. This would absolutely cripple my production of resources and cash, and troop production.

      Not only that, but the distance to my frontline would STILL BE -30!
      gyazo.com/1330cc2b7adc372daa5aa0482b72978f

      This second pic shows my frontline at Russia from Tsari (Tibet/Indo area) - so sure, this would help my morale in central Asia, but it would destroy my morale in all of Borneo, Philippines, Sumatra, Australia, NZ etc. (where almost all of my high level industry is) - particularly my core provinces.. and the other end (my frontline) would still be just as bad anyway.
    • YourGaurdian wrote:

      That's not true. If u shift ur capital to indo china, it won't affect morale/resources production in new south wales.
      Of course it will - it already is dropping as I already have penalties (expansion) - if I shift the capital, it will get more penalties.

      Currently, all my core provinces morale is already starting to drop too due to the expansion penalty (Theyre currently all at 82% but will fall to 72% due to -28% expansion penalty, and my production is already dropping due to it. Production is directly related to morale. (e.g. in a CORE city at 100% morale, you get 12,000 production. If morale is 90%, its only 10,800 production etc.)

      If I move the capital, they will then have a "Distance to capital" penalty of -30 also.

      100-30-28 = 42%. My 12k production will become only 5,040 production/h - per city. Thats a huge drop!
    • ryanb96 wrote:

      YourGaurdian wrote:

      That's not true. If u shift ur capital to indo china, it won't affect morale/resources production in new south wales.
      Of course it will - it already is dropping as I already have penalties (expansion) - if I shift the capital, it will get more penalties.
      Currently, all my core provinces morale is already starting to drop too due to the expansion penalty (Theyre currently all at 82% but will fall to 72% due to -28% expansion penalty, and my production is already dropping due to it. Production is directly related to morale. (e.g. in a CORE city at 100% morale, you get 12,000 production. If morale is 90%, its only 10,800 production etc.)

      If I move the capital, they will then have a "Distance to capital" penalty of -30 also.

      100-30-28 = 42%. My 12k production will become only 5,040 production/h - per city. Thats a huge drop!
      Listen, I have provinces far away from my capital that have 100% morale. YOUR PRODUCTION will not drop. Morale does not work that way.
      "A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic." - Joseph Stalin

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    • RBoi200 wrote:

      ryanb96 wrote:

      YourGaurdian wrote:

      That's not true. If u shift ur capital to indo china, it won't affect morale/resources production in new south wales.
      Of course it will - it already is dropping as I already have penalties (expansion) - if I shift the capital, it will get more penalties.Currently, all my core provinces morale is already starting to drop too due to the expansion penalty (Theyre currently all at 82% but will fall to 72% due to -28% expansion penalty, and my production is already dropping due to it. Production is directly related to morale. (e.g. in a CORE city at 100% morale, you get 12,000 production. If morale is 90%, its only 10,800 production etc.)

      If I move the capital, they will then have a "Distance to capital" penalty of -30 also.

      100-30-28 = 42%. My 12k production will become only 5,040 production/h - per city. Thats a huge drop!
      Listen, I have provinces far away from my capital that have 100% morale. YOUR PRODUCTION will not drop. Morale does not work that way.
      Clearly you are inexperienced and have never had 2k points in one game bro, because morale does work that way, and I've shown you pictures / evidence of it above. If you have a massive empire, you cannot maintain 100% morale due to expansion penalties, unless you build propaganda offices to level 3 for the +40%. Please don't comment again if you're not going to be helpful, I want devs to read and give feedback.

      Im not looking for an argument, I'm looking for help!
    • Dang... That's a forum. U know what that means?

      If u wanna have points and morale both, u need to be a little calm. Now here's a suggestion for future... If u play a longitudinal war/war over land mostly, don't go superfast. Capture cities ASA the day starts and defend them at day end. In this time, no city will be rebelled. Also the morale that was 25, now must be 32-35. Now if u are rich enough to build a prop office, ur morale the next day will be 45. Now if u capture provinces near u, the morale will rise a bit
    • YourGaurdian wrote:

      Dang... That's a forum. U know what that means?

      If u wanna have points and morale both, u need to be a little calm. Now here's a suggestion for future... If u play a longitudinal war/war over land mostly, don't go superfast. Capture cities ASA the day starts and defend them at day end. In this time, no city will be rebelled. Also the morale that was 25, now must be 32-35. Now if u are rich enough to build a prop office, ur morale the next day will be 45. Now if u capture provinces near u, the morale will rise a bit
      Bro are you not reading my posts?

      When you are big enough, you have morale penalties... So when you say "The morale that was 25 must now be 32-35" is wrong - instead it is 17-18 because it goes DOWN (not up) due to the penalties!
    • DoctorDR1 wrote:

      Friendly reminder to be polite. I don't want to intervene, but I will if I have to.
      Sorry, but I'm becoming incredibly frustrated at people repeatedly just spewing nonsense like "just put troops in them" or "move capital" or "recapture them" or "don't move so fast" and not actually reading my posts to understand why that doesn't solve the problem, and the flaw in the morale system that needs a dev to look at and fix. Meanwhile, here's todays look at how much morale has fallen on the most recent day change:

      gyazo.com/9152a7c172d923317c432b160e56bde4

      As you can see, the penalties are killing me!

      FYI: in the pic, the "red glowing provinces" mean they are now at chance of revolt
    • penalties are very very high, in such a downward trend how can one survive?
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