Amphibious Warfare

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    • Amphibious Warfare

      Call of war has always lacked an amphibious warfare aspect.

      New Units:
      Marines: Marines were widely used by all nations, especially the USA in World War II. Marines will have an 50% terrain advantage on coastal terrain. However, they have no bonuses on any other terrain. They deal a higher damage then infantry. They can disembark in a much shorter time then regular infantry. They can disembark within 30 minute. When in operating in sea they're automatically transformed into amphibious warfare ship.They are most effective against infantry. They're semi effective against light armor. They're useful for quickly securing a beachhead on the enemy coast.

      Assault Amphibious Vehicles: Similar to Marines they operate well on coastal terrain. They are most effectively used against light armor.They also require 30 minutes to disembark. When at sea they're transformed into amphibious warfare ships.

      New Terrain:
      Coast: Assault Amphibious Vehicles and Marines have a significant advantage on this terrain. The commando also has somewhat of an advantage on this terrain compared to other units.

    • Right off the bat, I think it would require a complete map rework. There's just a lot of coastal provinces. So I think you can rule out "coastal" as a terrain type.

      While the addition of marines makes good sense, the absence of marines always struck me as odd too, it doesn't add anything significantly to the game. There are naval invasions already and, I don't know about you, but those are some tense four and half hours for me sometimes. Troops are vulnerable during that time to attacks that normally would be less threatening (naval bombers, naval strikes). So, in a way, the essence of high stakes naval invasion is there.

      The way that the game is implemented you don't do combat until you have disembarked and reached the province center. There are rare cases where armies engage disembarking forces and perhaps here your assault vehicles and marines would shine. However it seems to me too small niche to justify adding another research line, another unit to build that is only situationally useful. Furthermore it would probably be a lot of development effort and in my opinion doesn't add enough to the game to warrant the investment.

    • I think marines make sense if implemented correctly. I presume they'd be quite expensive with few levels like Commandos, and their main purpose is the disembark times. Who said every province that borders water has to be coastal? Adding some coastal terrain can be done only to certain provinces, with some areas having way more or less provinces with such terrain based on the location's real life geography. This way normal provinces still have the 4 hour disembark. Perhaps there doesn't need to be a new terrain type at all, and instead marines with their 30 min can only disembark on plains provinces. As for the development effort, there are some niche units in the game that get no love, and could even be removed to make room for this new unit type if it became necessary. Besides, development is not something for us to make assumptions about, as that is for the developers to specify. We're here to give feedback and be told if something is not feasible. This is a new concept with many ideas that haven't even been thought of yet, and I think we should explore it more before shooting it down.

    • MZM7 wrote:

      I think marines make sense if implemented correctly. I presume they'd be quite expensive with few levels like Commandos, and their main purpose is the disembark times. Who said every province that borders water has to be coastal? Adding some coastal terrain can be done only to certain provinces, with some areas having way more or less provinces with such terrain based on the location's real life geography. This way normal provinces still have the 4 hour disembark. Perhaps there doesn't need to be a new terrain type at all, and instead marines with their 30 min can only disembark on plains provinces. As for the development effort, there are some niche units in the game that get no love, and could even be removed to make room for this new unit type if it became necessary. Besides, development is not something for us to make assumptions about, as that is for the developers to specify. We're here to give feedback and be told if something is not feasible. This is a new concept with many ideas that haven't even been thought of yet, and I think we should explore it more before shooting it down.
      VietCong, the original poster, suggested the new terrain type.

      It's not a new idea, it's been suggested numerous times. Just searching the suggestion forum for the word marine returns 16 pages of results. As recently as Jan 23rd someone posted a thread titled "Marines or sea infantry". VC's idea isn't bad, it's just not new and the developers have passed on adding it for years.

      I'm not "shooting it down", it's not up to me what features get implemented. VC asked for feedback and I provided it.
      I don't work for Bytro, but I've been a professional software engineer for 15 years. I have a little bit of an idea about development costs. I can tell you from experience how long it will take is going to factor into the decision making process about what features get added.

    • I know he suggested a new terrain type.. I mentioned it.. but that's not all he suggested. Sure, like I said we might be able to throw out the new terrain and just apply its attributes to plains, but that doesn't mean we throw out his whole suggestion.. I won't deny anybody's background in knowledge regarding development costs and times, and those things being factors in feature decisions is quite obvious. but my point still stands; I said what I said about assumptions because although making every province coastal would certainly be a monumental task, this concept doesn't have to go that far, and we should try to develop the concept in a more reasonable direction then.

      By the way, I say this is a new concept, not based on how long it's been in the forum, but how developed it is. Also, the idea for a new unit type isn't necessarily a concept, and I never said other players besides VC never had the idea. Some random players can mention wanting marines or think of it randomly, but the concept part is more about implementation within a reasonable framework. That's where one idea within a concept can be discarded, but the concept itself is still at play. There is so much creative room here, and some parts of it can be quite simple.

      For this specific concept, that this unit can threaten certain sections of a person's coast offers a whole new strategy aspect to coastal attack/defense. We should offer more suggestions and fully think it out so that we don't miss an opportunity.

    • MZM7 wrote:

      I know he suggested a new terrain type.. I mentioned it.. but that's not all he suggested. Sure, like I said we might be able to throw out the new terrain and just apply its attributes to plains, but that doesn't mean we throw out his whole suggestion.. I won't deny anybody's background in knowledge regarding development costs and times, and those things being factors in feature decisions is quite obvious. but my point still stands; I said what I said about assumptions because although making every province coastal would certainly be a monumental task, this concept doesn't have to go that far, and we should try to develop the concept in a more reasonable direction then.

      By the way, I say this is a new concept, not based on how long it's been in the forum, but how developed it is. Also, the idea for a new unit type isn't necessarily a concept, and I never said other players besides VC never had the idea. Some random players can mention wanting marines or think of it randomly, but the concept part is more about implementation within a reasonable framework. That's where one idea within a concept can be discarded, but the concept itself is still at play. There is so much creative room here, and some parts of it can be quite simple.

      For this specific concept, that this unit can threaten certain sections of a person's coast offers a whole new strategy aspect to coastal attack/defense. We should offer more suggestions and fully think it out so that we don't miss an opportunity.
      I'm willing to give the concept a fair hearing. You wrote that whole post arguing I should add something, but offered nothing yourself. I have given it thought myself and I don't think there's a way, certainly not an obvious one, to incorporate the new unit into the current framework.

      Let's say for argument's sake there is a marine unit and it mostly works like infantry except it has a shorter disembark time. At a minimum you would have to rework provinces to have a "beach" flag or something to that effect because some places suck to land no matter how good your assault craft is. Have you seen Gibraltar or the cliffs of Dover?

      What kind of tactical options does that give me? Let's see, I can land faster. That's it. If the marines are met with forces in the province they will probably not be able to overcome them without the support of the rest of the army, but they landed a full four hours earlier.

      What I would prefer to see is a landing craft tree that would simply reduce the disembark time in enemy territory by an amount. It could be researched just like transport ships.

    • I for one strongly support an amphibious assault unit, whether they are call Marines or whatever. They were widely used and would put a slightly different taste to strategies and tactics used in the game.

      Unfortunately this has been suggested several times to no avail :(

    • Spite_Is_Right wrote:

      I'm willing to give the concept a fair hearing. You wrote that whole post arguing I should add something, but offered nothing yourself.
      In the post before (the one you literally quoted), I mentioned getting rid of the new terrain type and possibly giving plains some of the properties VC mentioned like the 30 min disembark for marines. That's building on the concept, even if I didn't add a fancy new unit or something. C'mon, don't play this game with me.

      Spite_Is_Right wrote:

      What I would prefer to see is a landing craft tree that would simply reduce the disembark time in enemy territory by an amount. It could be researched just like transport ships.
      This is what I mean by adding to the concept. I like this idea a lot.