Province Exchange update

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    • Province Exchange update

      Heyo writing this post to talk about the current province exchange system of 1 province per 1 day after 7 days. I don't think I need to provide the background info of why on paper, being able to trade multiple provinces, is good. I've seen this discussed quite a few times already, and I've understood that the changes must be handled delicately, as more experienced players are rightfully concerned about the abuse that follows more liberal ideas. So with this in mind I would like to have another go at suggesting how the current province exchange feature could be changed, and would appreciate the criticism that comes along with such objective. :thumbsup:

      1. Remove a player's ability to trade core provinces.

      From a gameplay perspective trading a core province can be easily abused on the first day by trading a country's entire land. It also seems to do more harm than good, as the core's bonuses, resource and defence, provide too much of a benefit to give away for threats, land exchange or 500 oil :P (someone agreed to do this). It seems to be a feature the more wiser can use to exploit newer players.
      From a context perspective it wouldn't make sense, how would a country's leader get away with the insult of giving away territory, that likely has historical significance/dominant native population, to a foreign power willingly without be booted from their political party?

      2. Create a delay before territory is received 12hrs-2 days. Preventing construction of buildings and resource collection/province registration between both parties.

      Gameplay-wise, this delay would prevent immediate and rapid expansion of a country. So just to clarify, if country A traded their province with country B, the province would go into a 'grey province', it would be removed from their list of provinces, they would no longer have control over what to build and resources/VPs woulds not be received. Player A could however retake the province by attacking this province during the waiting period (the province would be treated as a right of way country, however Player A attacking this province would not automatically trigger war with Player B, but would reduce Player A's global popularity). Player B can put troops in the 'grey states' without fear of starting wars with Player A, however Player B would not receive any benefits (movement speed) or province registration until the timer has passed, whereby the province would be put under their control.
      From a context viewpoint, it adds a sense of realism as there would be an expected delay in transferring villages, populations and cities to another ruler (ie new rules put in place, new reforms made, new local authorities established).

      3. Have global popularity determine the likelihood of revolt from province exchange. Provinces that you trade would have a chance to revolt, if not suppressed, back to the original giving away party after the 'grey province' timer expires. This chance would be linked to positive popularity (>50%) with likelihood increasing as popularity increases. Alternatively, negative popularity (<50%) of the receiving country, would influence the grey state's decision, to revolt if not suppressed by the receiving or giving player.

      Gameplay-wise, this puts more relevance on global popularity and slows expansion of aggressive players through political routes. Context-wise, it makes sense that provinces/citizens wouldn't want to leave a country that has a good reputation, and willingly join a country that is know for violence and exploitation.

      4. Nerf ability to trade victory points. After a 'grey state' timer runs out and the province doesn't revolt, it should remain as a grey 'state' indefinitely until it is invaded, or the accepting country sends units (possibly limited to the infantry branch) to claim the city.

      Gameplay-wise, this regulates a countries ability to receive VP's and ultimately win, without having any military influence. It would also prevent a country from immediately establishing a recruitment base and producing an army on the other side of the world without putting activity and strategy into the game (assuming the giving player has no strategy of their own).
      Context wise, cities would have the most influence in a region, and you wouldn't expect a country to say yea "I'm going to sell hongkong to you" and not expect major backlash from the dense and influential population, without having the colonising country establish an equally large influence (in the presence of urban military occupation) that can go to door to, and establish itself as the legitimate government.

      *Player A- The person who is giving their territory to someone

      *Player B- The person in a trade who is receiving territory.

      *Grey state- A province that once traded remains neutral for a set period of time, any player can enter this province and capture it, if unoccupied, without the declaration of war. All players in this province will have a speed debuff with the exception of player A. If player A decides to recapture the Grey state pre and post revolt they will suffer a global popularity loss. Revolts for grey states will be similar to current in game mechanics, for more details see point three.

      Now we move onto the buffs.

      5. Add a 'liberation feature'. A mechanic whereby ground units can be set to automatically return captured core province territory to the original country.

      Game-play wise, this rewards and encourages players to remain active in the game, as allies can easily restore territory giving a greater chance for your country to be restored to it's former glory if you can just 'hang on' . This feature is similarly present in team events and so it wouldn't be a bad idea to make this optional in regular games and allow players to choose who to support and restore. Additionally, why not also apply this to AI countries? Restoring AI countries' core provinces would significantly increase their relationship with you and slightly improve global popularity, and on the very unlikely chance the ai whose status with you is set to share map, invades one of your captured core the territory, it would be restored back to you.
      Context-wise, it would seem appropriate that countries could easily give back territory to allies should they so choose to. It's strange how currently to return territory with the current province mechanics, you would have to either wait 3 'in game days' (1day irl = 3days in game), to restore one region at the most, at a time, meaning leaders would have to be on the landline each and every day to oversee the painfully slow restoration after an oppressive foreign government has been removed.

      6. Significantly increase the limit of non-core province if not infinite trades per day.

      Game-play wise, this suggestion isn't new. However if the current province trade mechanic is nerfed, this feature would significantly improve the player's experience with land trades, and concessional demands. It also gives players the option to reduce their responsibility of maintaining and worrying about newly captured territory, which instead could be sold/given to other nations to manage the front for you.
      Context wise, similar to what has been said in point five, world leaders shouldn't have to been in direct communication throughout the entirety of a land exchange. Instead it should be decided upon in a meeting and agreed by treaties and pacts, that left to original intentions, would see the eventual transfer of land. Furthermore, why shouldn't a player whose captured territory and won victories, have an immediate say on how much of someone's territory belong to the person of their choosing.

      That's all I got for the moment ^^ would love to hear from the community and see any of these features considered, just to give the province trading mechanic some love, and to really remove the unnecessary red tape (ie having to declare war on a country to exchange more than 1 province).
      Make HWW all in, a staple gamemode :thumbup:

      The post was edited 5 times, last by Nadda ().

    • First off, the time period is 7 DAYS not weeks before you can trade provinces. Now to discuss your ideas. It is not just that trading MULTIPLE provinces could be abused but the increased likelihood that it WOULD BE abused. The reason for the limits currently in place are likely due to previous experience learned the hard way by the Devs (or previous Devs).

      1. I will trade with an ally for a non resource core (or near to their core) on occasion for the sole purpose of building an air strip near or in their core that will allow me to help protect them while not online and have my units be able to heal. I would object to any change on what provinces can be traded.

      2. Explain WHY there should be a delay? The day 7 limit and 1 per day limit as currently in effect perfectly protects and

      Nadda wrote:

      prevent immediate and rapid expansion of a country.
      The delay would just be an unnecessary complication. Also the change in morale of traded provinces already ADDS time to the construction of buildings and units, what you are suggesting just is more of an already existing penalty when provinces are traded.

      3. Depending on the morale of the province BEFORE the trade the province may slip and be at risk of rebelling already. The higher the morale the less likely this is to occur but for recent or fairly recent conquered provinces the chance is the same as a if you had conquered it yourself (ie 25). Also as a player that expands every day from day 1 having my global popularity influence the change of revolt is just an additional unfair penalty in addition to the already in place expansion penalty.

      4. Changing to the way you trade cities as you describe sounds OVERCOMPLEX and more than likely would lead to even more complaints about AI nations being overly aggressive and declaring war on players. Additionally WHO is this neutral Gray state? Would each city be an independent nation? Or would all be part of the same independent nation? If each is an independent nation this will only lead to expanding players having even lower global popularity sooner and thus having more AI enemies sooner. If they all belong to the same neutral nation would I be at war with cities other players have traded? Once again an overly complex and unnecessary additional rule.

      5. First off if you are in a coalition with another nation this feature of returning core provinces is ALREADY in effect. In fact it is not limited in any way by the province trade limits. As for reinstating provinces to conquered AI nations it would complicate things again. Can you only restore provinces to nations still in existence or can you restore nations that have been totally conquered and wiped out? Your suggestion just raises more questions than it answers.

      6. Increasing trading limits to unlimited per day is just as asking for the system to be abused by players. Either giving or getting. By giving away provinces a player could drop his expansion penalty while only keeping the victory point provinces. By receiving a player could be getting resources from non core provinces that have not been earned by conquest and could be used to supply and support another nation. This is in fact what most multiple account players do, they send resources from "an allied nation" to a warring nation that is only concerned with building units for conquest and has no NEED to expand its resource production as it gets them from its ally. Your suggestion would only lead to abuse.
      "Strategy is the art of making use of time and space. I am less concerned about the later than the former. Space we can recover, lost time never." ~ Napoleon Bonaparte

      "Anyone who has to fight, even with the most modern weapons, against an enemy in complete command of the air, fights like a savage against modern European troops, under the same handicaps and with the same chances of success." ~ Erwin Rommel