Direct attack on flight units while retrieving

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    • Direct attack on flight units while retrieving

      So this is the thing I think it is a bit bugged and needs some fixing. I hope I'll be able to adress myself properly so that every one would understand what I'm talking about.


      I have 7 tactical bombers on patrol over some teritory. I also had some interceptors patroling there aswell, just in case of a surprise interceptor attack from the enemy.

      Anyhow, I saw enemy interceptors flying with direct attack on my tactical bombers. I immidiately stoped patroling with my tac bombers and retrieve them to base, while my interceptors were left there just in case.
      Anyhow, every unit has its own 'RED DOT' on the map so that you can see where your units are currently positioned, so does the planes aswell (unless they are on patrol, then they have a blue circle). Anyhow, after I've retrieved them to the base I saw that red dot so I know where they are currently in the air and they were moving back to the base. When every I mouse over on enemy interceptors I could see a time ticking for the next attack - it was like 1min and 28 seconds and that time DIDN't CHANGE even though I have started retrieving my tactical bombers away from him!

      I was waiting for that minute and a half and attack ACTUALLY happened... I was shocked!
      Attack happened in this order:
      1) Enemy interceptors were moving to the initial location of my tactical bombers (the initial attack clock)
      2) after they reached that initial location, they TELEPORTED to the new location of my tactical bombers (which was at least 5-6 min of flight needed!!)
      3) After attack they started retrieving from that 'new teleported' location back to their base


      Basically - I think this is a bug - My tac bombers have been on the retrieve and interceptors just couldn't have been able to have the same attack timer as if my tac bombers were on patrol...

    • I would not say it is a bug, rather it is a game mechanic feature to prevent players from positioning units in such a way as to always be able to escape, especially units that have been on patrol. If the player that launched the interceptors is away and does not stop those interceptors they should continue to "attack" the location where your bombers were located and can be dealt with accordingly. If it was a one off attack then it is the price of patrolling. One final issue I will raise is that usually even if close to the same research level interceptors are much faster than any bomber and would be able to catch almost any attempt to run. As an Air Power player I understand the feeling you should be able to escape from danger (and have tried to do so in the past myself) but in the interest of fair play I can understand being attacked once in a situation as you describe.
      "Strategy is the art of making use of time and space. I am less concerned about the later than the former. Space we can recover, lost time never." ~ Napoleon Bonaparte

      "Anyone who has to fight, even with the most modern weapons, against an enemy in complete command of the air, fights like a savage against modern European troops, under the same handicaps and with the same chances of success." ~ Erwin Rommel

    • I don't think this is necessarily a bug, I think it's just a simplification for gameplay purposes. In reality, if bombers started to retreat, the interceptors would change their course to, well, intercept them. Forcing a player to be constantly online for the duration of the attack to continually adjust course is unrealistic, and automating it is probably difficult too. This seems like a fine solution--the interceptors go to where the planes used to be, attack, and return home.

    • Not a bug, always worked like this, and rightly so.
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.

    • On land and sea, ordering attack on a moving unit sends the attacker to the defender's location when the order is given.
      At arrival, it will automatically re=target the defender at its current location. This will happen repeatedly until engagement or new orders.

      Should work the same way in the air - Keep retargeting until engagement or defender out of range.
      Any teleportation is a bug.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Nooberium ().

    • Nooberium wrote:

      On land and sea, ordering attack on a moving unit sends the attacker to the defender's location when the order is given.
      At arrival, it will automatically re=target the defender at its current location. This will happen repeatedly until engagement or new orders.

      Should work the same way in the air - Keep retargeting until engagement or defender out of range.
      Any teleportation is a bug.
      Exactly!
      As it is working for ground units, same should be implemented for air aswell.

    • My take on this is that if your bombers were on patrol, they were "somewhere inside the purple circle", not necessarily at the red dot where you centred their patrol area. It's like a quantum particle thing - your patrol exists simultaneously at all places within the patrol area so you get the benefit of bombing all targets in the area simultaneously when the clock ticks.

      When you retreated your bombers, you were not retreating from the red dot per se, as your bombers existed simultaneously at all positions within the purple circle. The dot is just your "average position" and your planes might just as well have been at the leading edge of the patrol area nearest the enemy interceptors when they reached your bombers. It's all just a matter for convenience of players and programmers.

    • polixenes wrote:

      My take on this is that if your bombers were on patrol, they were "somewhere inside the purple circle", not necessarily at the red dot where you centred their patrol area.
      This is a most common mistake in understanding how Air Power works.

      The RED DOT is key, that is where the planes are !

      Blue circle is their area of influence but RED DOT is key. So if you set your fighters to patrol over a stack of Bombers, and your blue circle touches theirs... NOTHING will happen, your fighters will never interact with the enemy stack.

      Your fighters Blue Dot must cover their RED DOT in order to engage them.

      Only then do the fireworks start.

      On Patrol, fighters will have influence of the entire area of the Blue Circle even if it extends past the fighter's range (white line limit)

      As for Direct Combat, once you set a target to hit, so long as the target's RED DOT is not out of your range (white line limit) when your unit reaches original location targeted, you will carry out your attack (even if unit has moved away), if target has moved our of your range (Not talking about the Blue Circle here) but actual White Line fighter range, only then would you attack fail to deal any damage.

      I think part of this is just simply the "mechanics" of a browser based game. You can't re-target countless aircraft trajectories or servers would bog down in calculations. This way only 1 calculation made when target is set, then a verification that target is in range when it's hit.... easy peasy and you can run more than 1 game per server.
      General Maximus Decimus Meridius - "Are you not entertained?"

    • OneNutSquirrel wrote:

      polixenes wrote:


      Blue circle is their area of influence but RED DOT is key. So if you set your fighters to patrol over a stack of Bombers, and your blue circle touches theirs... NOTHING will happen, your fighters will never interact with the enemy stack.
      They will ABSOLUTELY interact, and your fighters will start shooting down bombers as soon as the circles overlap JUST a little bit, as soon as the tick comes.
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.

    • That's NOT how it works K.R.

      Try it and wait for the tic, It has NEVER worked that way. You will not even see other air units with your own until their RED DOT enters your Blue Circle area of effect. You will not see an enemy airplane's area of effect (Blue Circle) until you can see the airplane,s location (RED DOT). (this is based on aircraft moving in Fog of War not over your territory.. because there, your territory is "seeing" for you, not your planes.)

      This is by far the single most common misunderstanding of using Aircraft.
      General Maximus Decimus Meridius - "Are you not entertained?"

    • Actually it is a favorite tactic of mine, to keep OUT of sight from the enemy but IN combat range, which happens when the circles overlap JUST a little bit and there are no other spotters around. His planes get shot down and he doesn't understand how. So yeah, I'm 100% sure that overlapping is enough. You try it, squirrel, and see for yourself.
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.

    • No, view range is SLIGHTLY smaller. You have to make the intersection really small though.
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.

    • Unless the enemy RED DOT indicating their location is IN YOUR BLUE CIRCLE, you can NOT even see their unit !

      So how can you engage it.

      Try it in the fog of war, not over your own territory.

      It is impossible to interact with units when their actual location (RED DOT) is out of your line of sight. Plain and simple.

      On the other hand, lets have a game cuz if this how you use your aircraft, My KD is getting a nice boost.
      General Maximus Decimus Meridius - "Are you not entertained?"

    • Sorry Squirrel as a LONG time (now going on 5+ years) user of air power, if the blue circles are touching the 2 stacks of aircraft WILL attack each other, the red dot location has nothing to do with where an attack will occur. (except being the center of the circle) This has been the case since before 1.5 much less now in 2.0. Any unit in or under the blue circle gets attacked, this is the additional value of using patrol to attack, it is also why you can destroy units OUTSIDE of the range of the aircraft by placing the circle so it extends past the range circle.
      "Strategy is the art of making use of time and space. I am less concerned about the later than the former. Space we can recover, lost time never." ~ Napoleon Bonaparte

      "Anyone who has to fight, even with the most modern weapons, against an enemy in complete command of the air, fights like a savage against modern European troops, under the same handicaps and with the same chances of success." ~ Erwin Rommel

    • K.Rokossovski wrote:

      Actually it is a favorite tactic of mine, to keep OUT of sight from the enemy but IN combat range, which happens when the circles overlap JUST a little bit and there are no other spotters around. His planes get shot down and he doesn't understand how. So yeah, I'm 100% sure that overlapping is enough. You try it, squirrel, and see for yourself.
      Squirrel - This is how i killed Ruy's air force way back when (note - he left them on patrol during his nap)

      I thought I read somewhere that air-air damage is more or less depending on how much the patrol circles overlap but haven't verified that.

    • Corrected

      If you have read that somewhere I am going to inform you it is FALSE info, the amount of damage you do has nothing to do with the patrol circle just as much as the false info that you do more healing in your capital or core. In fact it would be to future readers best interest if you edited and removed that comment.
      "Strategy is the art of making use of time and space. I am less concerned about the later than the former. Space we can recover, lost time never." ~ Napoleon Bonaparte

      "Anyone who has to fight, even with the most modern weapons, against an enemy in complete command of the air, fights like a savage against modern European troops, under the same handicaps and with the same chances of success." ~ Erwin Rommel

      The post was edited 1 time, last by S Schmidt ().