Attacker vs Defender ground units

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    • Attacker vs Defender ground units

      It ıs hard to understand why people spam med tanks and moto infantries like crazy

      they are totally useless even with doctrine bonuses

      Defensive units always better than attacker ones
      Because you can destroy enemy units with artillery , rocket , railroad gun , plane and ship
      Why you need to produce 999 med tanks and rush everywhere randomly ?
      if enemy attacker units are rushing you , put defensive units front of them , if you want rush you have a lot of option to start rush like arty,ship,rocket,plane etc. , is it not basic ?

      Why you dont prefer infantries , armored cars and tank destroyers instead of motorized infantries and med tanks
      They are cheaper
      You can produce more

      If your ground army is defensive you have never problem
      Because If you want you can attack too
      But ıf your army is attacker you cant defense
      and you will have always problems

    • I use defensive troops and artillery also, but it does require paying a lot more attention to the game and details of battles and positions. With a big stack of tanks you can just send them on a march and not have to micromanage so much. I've never actually done that, but I might try something like that to see how it works in terms of personal time required focusing on the game.

    • Another advantage is the hvy armor class and high health of med tanks; you can use them as damage soakers. When you use tanks in (for example) an artillery stack, it will be much tougher when it comes to a (rocket) artillery-artillery battle, and all other things being equal, you will beat someone who is using AC's instead. Air stacks without attack bombers will also struggle to knock you out.

      Motorized infantry is indeed a questionable unit, but their speed is unparalleled so they make the fastest rush unit available in the game, especially in Axis doctrine.
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.

    • K.Rokossovski wrote:

      Another advantage is the hvy armor class and high health of med tanks; you can use them as damage soakers. When you use tanks in (for example) an artillery stack, it will be much tougher when it comes to a (rocket) artillery-artillery battle, and all other things being equal, you will beat someone who is using AC's instead. Air stacks without attack bombers will also struggle to knock you out.

      Motorized infantry is indeed a questionable unit, but their speed is unparalleled so they make the fastest rush unit available in the game, especially in Axis doctrine.
      I think we should compare med tank vs tank destroyer not armored car

      instead of motorized infantry , produce armored car at the beginning seems better option

    • I compared them to AC because they are one of the most popular units, while TD is fringe... but yeah, TD's work just as well as MT's as damage soakers. MT's can still do some damage against enemy inf though.

      As I said, motorized infantry is slightly faster than AC's. But yeah, AC is more versatile so I prefer those as well.
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.

    • Also as Axis Mot Inf is available day 1 and it is one of the best attacking units in the game there is a reason people build them whereas ACs are strictly a defensive unit.
      "Strategy is the art of making use of time and space. I am less concerned about the later than the former. Space we can recover, lost time never." ~ Napoleon Bonaparte

      "Anyone who has to fight, even with the most modern weapons, against an enemy in complete command of the air, fights like a savage against modern European troops, under the same handicaps and with the same chances of success." ~ Erwin Rommel

    • S Schmidt wrote:

      Also as Axis Mot Inf is available day 1 and it is one of the best attacking units in the game there is a reason people build them whereas ACs are strictly a defensive unit.
      at the beginning , all players are waiting at their core provinces so defenders have %15 defense bonus without terrain bonus
      armored car needs 2 hour to produce
      motorized infantry needs 5 hours and 30 min to produce
      motorized infantry cant give high damage to armored units

      I wrote production times from allies doctrine but we can say armored car is better than motorized inf

      if you have artillery , ship , plane , rocket , railroad gun why you will lose units with attacking
      and at this stage all of players are going to artillery

    • Well my actually experience with Axis Motorized Infantry tells me that you cant beat them in the first 4 days of the game as attackers. I have used them and defeated mixed Inf and AC stacks on day 1, I can have at least 4 built and in action with LTs on day 1 as Axis, artillery isnt going to stop them either so your claims they arent worthwhile are invalid as you seem to not have ever used them properly as an Axis player.
      "Strategy is the art of making use of time and space. I am less concerned about the later than the former. Space we can recover, lost time never." ~ Napoleon Bonaparte

      "Anyone who has to fight, even with the most modern weapons, against an enemy in complete command of the air, fights like a savage against modern European troops, under the same handicaps and with the same chances of success." ~ Erwin Rommel

    • S Schmidt wrote:

      Well my actually experience with Axis Motorized Infantry tells me that you cant beat them in the first 4 days of the game as attackers. I have used them and defeated mixed Inf and AC stacks on day 1, I can have at least 4 built and in action with LTs on day 1 as Axis, artillery isnt going to stop them either so your claims they arent worthwhile are invalid as you seem to not have ever used them properly as an Axis player.
      yeah people mostly start to game with south american countries and they produce moto infantry like crazy

      by the way all continent contain forest provinces ,
      %15 home defense bonus
      %20 forest terrain bonus

      and all continent mostly contain axis players %15 hp and damage bonus is totally useless for moto infantry

      motorized infantry can give 3 damage to armored car
      and you can produce faster armored cars

      armored car can give 6 damage to moto infantry
      infantry can give 7 damage to moto infantry

      you can keep to play with moto infantry of course , even you achieve to invade some lands at first days , at the middle of game these units are totally useless if they can stay alive
      but It seems you lose a lot of units with melee fighting at the beginning

      The post was edited 4 times, last by Undaunted ().

    • S Schmidt wrote:

      Also as Axis Mot Inf is available day 1 and it is one of the best attacking units in the game there is a reason people build them whereas ACs are strictly a defensive unit.
      This is a very common misconception. Even if their defense values are higher than offense ones, AC's make a fine attack unit against infantry, especially in the plains, or at higher levels.
      When the fake daddies are curtailed, we have failed. When their roller coaster tolerance is obliterated, their education funds are taken by Kazakhstani phishers, and their candy bars distributed between the Botswana youth gangs, we have succeeded.
      - BIG DADDY.

    • Yes in theory you are right but in practice not, for one thing you can build motorized infantry on the side and build industry.
      On the other hand, they are the fastest unit on the ground and not alone. You can attack with your AC but it is not good against the start infantry. But motorized infantry is unarmored like infantry so the damage distribution is 100% on unarmored. He can also take AC with him as well as planes.

      You must never compare individual units if your opponent only has a heavy or medium tank, tactical bomber or something like that your AC are useless.

    • Blackscall wrote:

      Yes in theory you are right but in practice not, for one thing you can build motorized infantry on the side and build industry.
      On the other hand, they are the fastest unit on the ground and not alone. You can attack with your AC but it is not good against the start infantry. But motorized infantry is unarmored like infantry so the damage distribution is 100% on unarmored. He can also take AC with him as well as planes.

      You must never compare individual units if your opponent only has a heavy or medium tank, tactical bomber or something like that your AC are useless.
      The misconception k. Rokkosovski was talking about is this. Maybe the attack value aint great, BUT, if you have a good amount of them they will easily compensate, AND they suffer less damage from (starting) infantry/anti-infantry THUS they are more durable and suitable. next to that they are available from the start, have later on decent air resistance and can scout as well.

    • Gen. Smit wrote:

      Blackscall wrote:

      Yes in theory you are right but in practice not, for one thing you can build motorized infantry on the side and build industry.
      On the other hand, they are the fastest unit on the ground and not alone. You can attack with your AC but it is not good against the start infantry. But motorized infantry is unarmored like infantry so the damage distribution is 100% on unarmored. He can also take AC with him as well as planes.

      You must never compare individual units if your opponent only has a heavy or medium tank, tactical bomber or something like that your AC are useless.
      The misconception k. Rokkosovski was talking about is this. Maybe the attack value aint great, BUT, if you have a good amount of them they will easily compensate, AND they suffer less damage from (starting) infantry/anti-infantry THUS they are more durable and suitable. next to that they are available from the start, have later on decent air resistance and can scout as well.
      why all of you think , only you can keep produce something , enemy doesn't produce anything and enemy doesn't move its units

      until you research and produce motorized infantry
      enemy can research and produce many armored car

      even we think it for plains armored car has %50 bonus , motorized infantry has %25 bonus
      and we didn't add even home defense bonus

      if enemy is axis player it is harder
      if you are fighting at south america , which continent has many forest and axis player it is impossible

      on the other side you think really they suffer less damage from infantry lol
      try add them %15 axis bonus , %15 home defense bonus and %20 forest terrain bonus

    • Undaunted wrote:

      It ıs hard to understand why people spam med tanks and moto infantries like crazy

      they are totally useless even with doctrine bonuses

      Defensive units always better than attacker ones
      Because you can destroy enemy units with artillery , rocket , railroad gun , plane and ship
      Why you need to produce 999 med tanks and rush everywhere randomly ?
      if enemy attacker units are rushing you , put defensive units front of them , if you want rush you have a lot of option to start rush like arty,ship,rocket,plane etc. , is it not basic ?

      Why you dont prefer infantries , armored cars and tank destroyers instead of motorized infantries and med tanks
      They are cheaper
      You can produce more

      If your ground army is defensive you have never problem
      Because If you want you can attack too
      But ıf your army is attacker you cant defense
      and you will have always problems
      But i don't get it, you can't win with this strategy! It would take to long for you. And i did say that the attacker and defender is producing units of diveren't kinds. You just talk about how bad motorized infantry is against AC. I do understand med tank is not always the best choise, but has some really good sides!

    • Blackscall wrote:

      Undaunted wrote:

      It ıs hard to understand why people spam med tanks and moto infantries like crazy

      they are totally useless even with doctrine bonuses

      Defensive units always better than attacker ones
      Because you can destroy enemy units with artillery , rocket , railroad gun , plane and ship
      Why you need to produce 999 med tanks and rush everywhere randomly ?
      if enemy attacker units are rushing you , put defensive units front of them , if you want rush you have a lot of option to start rush like arty,ship,rocket,plane etc. , is it not basic ?

      Why you dont prefer infantries , armored cars and tank destroyers instead of motorized infantries and med tanks
      They are cheaper
      You can produce more

      If your ground army is defensive you have never problem
      Because If you want you can attack too
      But ıf your army is attacker you cant defense
      and you will have always problems
      But i don't get it, you can't win with this strategy! It would take to long for you. And i did say that the attacker and defender is producing units of diveren't kinds. You just talk about how bad motorized infantry is against AC. I do understand med tank is not always the best choise, but has some really good sides!
      nowadays I won with Hungary as solo at x4 speed 73p map with this strategy I had tank destroyers , armored cars , infantries , artilleries , anti airs , interceptors , rocket fighters ,rockets ,railroad guns , nuclear weapons , submarines

      I attacked enemy airstrips with rockets and destroyed convoys with my planes
      and if they tried to attack me with mechanized infantry or med and heavy tanks , I put my tank destroyer front of my ranged units

      I didn't use any med , heavy tank or motorized and mechanized infantry
      and I didn't use gold

      what are good sides of med tanks ? you might attack like a kamikaze and don't need to look game too much ??

      The post was edited 4 times, last by Undaunted ().

    • Undaunted wrote:

      Gen. Smit wrote:

      Blackscall wrote:

      Yes in theory you are right but in practice not, for one thing you can build motorized infantry on the side and build industry.
      On the other hand, they are the fastest unit on the ground and not alone. You can attack with your AC but it is not good against the start infantry. But motorized infantry is unarmored like infantry so the damage distribution is 100% on unarmored. He can also take AC with him as well as planes.

      You must never compare individual units if your opponent only has a heavy or medium tank, tactical bomber or something like that your AC are useless.
      The misconception k. Rokkosovski was talking about is this. Maybe the attack value aint great, BUT, if you have a good amount of them they will easily compensate, AND they suffer less damage from (starting) infantry/anti-infantry THUS they are more durable and suitable. next to that they are available from the start, have later on decent air resistance and can scout as well.
      why all of you think , only you can keep produce something , enemy doesn't produce anything and enemy doesn't move its units
      until you research and produce motorized infantry
      enemy can research and produce many armored car

      even we think it for plains armored car has %50 bonus , motorized infantry has %25 bonus
      and we didn't add even home defense bonus

      if enemy is axis player it is harder
      if you are fighting at south america , which continent has many forest and axis player it is impossible

      on the other side you think really they suffer less damage from infantry lol
      try add them %15 axis bonus , %15 home defense bonus and %20 forest terrain bonus
      MAybe I am wrong but it seems you talk in favour of the AC? As do I.

      In the other case Motorized infantry, defense? I do not think they were designed for that, in any case you can develop in the mean time and soft target destroyer like SP-RA or tactical bombers, and it will be byebye with all the advantages of the motorized infantry. On paper they look great, but in practice they are very feeble.

    • Undaunted wrote:

      Blackscall wrote:

      Undaunted wrote:

      It ıs hard to understand why people spam med tanks and moto infantries like crazy

      they are totally useless even with doctrine bonuses

      Defensive units always better than attacker ones
      Because you can destroy enemy units with artillery , rocket , railroad gun , plane and ship
      Why you need to produce 999 med tanks and rush everywhere randomly ?
      if enemy attacker units are rushing you , put defensive units front of them , if you want rush you have a lot of option to start rush like arty,ship,rocket,plane etc. , is it not basic ?

      Why you dont prefer infantries , armored cars and tank destroyers instead of motorized infantries and med tanks
      They are cheaper
      You can produce more

      If your ground army is defensive you have never problem
      Because If you want you can attack too
      But ıf your army is attacker you cant defense
      and you will have always problems
      But i don't get it, you can't win with this strategy! It would take to long for you. And i did say that the attacker and defender is producing units of diveren't kinds. You just talk about how bad motorized infantry is against AC. I do understand med tank is not always the best choise, but has some really good sides!
      nowadays I won with Hungary as solo at x4 speed 73p map with this strategy I had tank destroyers , armored cars , infantries , artilleries , anti airs , interceptors , rocket fighters ,rockets ,railroad guns , nuclear weapons , submarines
      I attacked enemy airstrips with rockets and destroyed convoys with my planes
      and if they tried to attack me with mechanized infantry or med and heavy tanks , I put my tank destroyer front of my ranged units

      I didn't use any med , heavy tank or motorized and mechanized infantry
      and I didn't use gold

      what are good sides of med tanks ? you might attack like a kamikaze and don't need to look game too much ??
      Yeah but only AC doesn't work if you have other units yes and true motorized infantry is very special to play it is good and the fastes way to gather provinces after breakthrough and for AI. They normaly don't yous heavy Units! For fights agianst normal Player well you need to be very careful!

      I think you are an attelery guy, are you?

    • Blackscall wrote:

      Undaunted wrote:

      Blackscall wrote:

      Undaunted wrote:

      It ıs hard to understand why people spam med tanks and moto infantries like crazy

      they are totally useless even with doctrine bonuses

      Defensive units always better than attacker ones
      Because you can destroy enemy units with artillery , rocket , railroad gun , plane and ship
      Why you need to produce 999 med tanks and rush everywhere randomly ?
      if enemy attacker units are rushing you , put defensive units front of them , if you want rush you have a lot of option to start rush like arty,ship,rocket,plane etc. , is it not basic ?

      Why you dont prefer infantries , armored cars and tank destroyers instead of motorized infantries and med tanks
      They are cheaper
      You can produce more

      If your ground army is defensive you have never problem
      Because If you want you can attack too
      But ıf your army is attacker you cant defense
      and you will have always problems
      But i don't get it, you can't win with this strategy! It would take to long for you. And i did say that the attacker and defender is producing units of diveren't kinds. You just talk about how bad motorized infantry is against AC. I do understand med tank is not always the best choise, but has some really good sides!
      nowadays I won with Hungary as solo at x4 speed 73p map with this strategy I had tank destroyers , armored cars , infantries , artilleries , anti airs , interceptors , rocket fighters ,rockets ,railroad guns , nuclear weapons , submarinesI attacked enemy airstrips with rockets and destroyed convoys with my planes
      and if they tried to attack me with mechanized infantry or med and heavy tanks , I put my tank destroyer front of my ranged units

      I didn't use any med , heavy tank or motorized and mechanized infantry
      and I didn't use gold

      what are good sides of med tanks ? you might attack like a kamikaze and don't need to look game too much ??
      Yeah but only AC doesn't work if you have other units yes and true motorized infantry is very special to play it is good and the fastes way to gather provinces after breakthrough and for AI. They normaly don't yous heavy Units! For fights agianst normal Player well you need to be very careful!
      I think you are an attelery guy, are you?
      Mot. Infantry is cannon fodder for tactical bombers. sorry they are really "no good" in the long term, so better not invest in them.