Strategic bomber discussion

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    • Strategic bomber discussion

      My biggest concern its the lack of counter, i was able to defeat in my games, interceptor & rocket fighters with them, anti-air cannot protect all cities at once, strat bombers are able to just ignore the city with anti air or destroy them if there are to few anti air.



      Now after a enemy defeat my force of interceptor with just strat bombers & i cant do any counter play i made this post.



      In my opinion strat bomber need some nerf. Not make them useless but add some counter play against them.


      What do you think about? Wanna hear opinions
      "Si crees que esto tendrá un final feliz, es que no has estado prestando atención"

    • Ever heard of the B-17?

      Now you have, and no more explanation is needed.

      But all jokes aside, yes i think they are awfully OP, the main issue is that you can stack them in stupidly large stacks and they got like 3k health, which becomes almost impossible to counter, but a few high level rockets does the job for me.
      "I have not failed, i have just found 10,000 ways that wont work." - Thomas Edison

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    • Hmm strat bombers with no counter play, lets see.

      They are slow, expensive and deal no damage to land units. To reach their target they usually have to fly deep into hostile territory so they cant be escorted by interceptors. If you build them and enemy has meaningful amount of interceptors they are usless.

      You can counter them by just building interceptors and being active. You put your anti air in your airbase so they wont bomb it.
      If someone has invested in strat bombers i dont see how you could lose air superiority. Just build 3 interceptors for every 2 strat bombers he has(same cost).

      They are OP only against players who log in twice a day. Otherwise they are very situational.

    • First on all im very active, but i have to accept no a lot of ppl are that active, im not the best but i consider myself very competent, so even if after a year of playing with strat bombers i never touch this topic before until i suffer the defeat against a enemy who use my own tactics against me.
      Its easy to defeat interceptor or rocket fighter with steat bombers trust me i know, got 20 panasian interceptors and lose them against 10 allies strat bombers even when i was microing my interceptors

      strategic bomber requieres 4 direct shot attacks from interceptors to be shoting down, knowing this its simple just accept the damage and blow the airstrip of the interceptor or rocket fighter even if there are AA, interceptors then go to another aistrip and have to refuel, then i just blow the second aistrip & i am able to defeat interceptor with just strategic bombers.

      This is a problem for a game. It could be really frustrating for opponents the idea of no matter what, even if he defeat my army he will lose the match due the destruccion of his base.

      The solution of the problem could be simple, even if the airstrip is shut down, the planes Could keep flying if there is another aistrip on their range.

      Maybe reduce their hp a little bit.
      "Si crees que esto tendrá un final feliz, es que no has estado prestando atención"

    • Fox-Company wrote:

      Ever heard of the B-17?

      Now you have, and no more explanation is needed.

      But all jokes aside, yes i think they are awfully OP, the main issue is that you can stack them in stupidly large stacks and they got like 3k health, which becomes almost impossible to counter, but a few high level rockets does the job for me.
      Also the Lanc. Pre-WWII strategic bombing doctrine was built on the assumption that "the bomber will always get through" after all.
      I do home you're talking about using rockets on bases/refueling planes. Unless they're patrolling it's darn hard to get them to hit aircrafy
      Aeroplanes are interesting toys but of no military value.
      — Marshal Foch

      A pretty mechanical toy [...] the war will never be won by such machines.
      — Lord Kitchener, on tanks

    • Danieliyoverde123 wrote:

      My biggest concern its the lack of counter, i was able to defeat in my games, interceptor & rocket fighters with them, anti-air cannot protect all cities at once, strat bombers are able to just ignore the city with anti air or destroy them if there are to few anti air.

      Now after a enemy defeat my force of interceptor with just strat bombers & i cant do any counter play i made this post.

      In my opinion strat bomber need some nerf. Not make them useless but add some counter play against them.
      What do you think about? Wanna hear opinions
      Out-produce him. I know this sounds simplistic, but assuming you have economies of similar size, you can make enough counters (anti-air or interceptors). In Pan-Asian, a lvl.3 only has 1.8 defence on aircraft (with 27 offence on buildings) and 45 hp, whereas a lvl.3 interceptor has 11.5 damage vs aircraft, and 23 hp. Anti-air lvl.3 does 11 vs air with 27 hp. However, a bomber costs as much as two anti-air, and two bombers cost as much as three fighters. I admit this doctrine gives buffs to interceptors but even so the point stands.

      Use operational air power too. If you have any sort of air superiority, use your own strats to take out airstrips; they are useless without them. Then use tacs and attack bombers to take out the resultant convoy units.
      Aeroplanes are interesting toys but of no military value.
      — Marshal Foch

      A pretty mechanical toy [...] the war will never be won by such machines.
      — Lord Kitchener, on tanks

    • Just wondering. As Pan-asian cant you hit his bombers once and have enough time to refuel? Its 30% difference in speed between slowest and fastest planes (not counting rocket fighters). With upgraded airstrip you have 10min refueling time.

      It's impossible you can sustain bombing airstrips with aa while being hit by interceptors. Every such attack puts you way behind for the next attack. (damaged strat bombers are slow af so basicly usless).

      And you are the one who can constantly invade his air space because you have air superiority. So you should be the one with initiative. Pan-asian with air superiority over Allies means you can run around his troops all day and he cant respond.

      If he has 10 strat bombers he probably lacks tactical bombers to follow so lets say you have airstrip lvl1 with 20interceptors. He has 2 options:
      -He attacks the airstrip. So you hit him once with interceptors before his attack. And he destroys your airstrip loaded with aa. 30min and you have new airstrip and he has badly damaged strat fighters.
      If you have lvl3 airstrip you should hit twice before his attack.
      -He ignores the airstrip and goes for base. In this scenerio you will hit him 2 or 3 times before he reaches your city and you finish them when they go back. So his start bombers are very expensive rockets basicly.

    • Sewur wrote:

      Just wondering. As Pan-asian cant you hit his bombers once and have enough time to refuel? Its 30% difference in speed between slowest and fastest planes (not counting rocket fighters). With upgraded airstrip you have 10min refueling time.

      It's impossible you can sustain bombing airstrips with aa while being hit by interceptors. Every such attack puts you way behind for the next attack. (damaged strat bombers are slow af so basicly usless).

      And you are the one who can constantly invade his air space because you have air superiority. So you should be the one with initiative. Pan-asian with air superiority over Allies means you can run around his troops all day and he cant respond.

      If he has 10 strat bombers he probably lacks tactical bombers to follow so lets say you have airstrip lvl1 with 20interceptors. He has 2 options:
      -He attacks the airstrip. So you hit him once with interceptors before his attack. And he destroys your airstrip loaded with aa. 30min and you have new airstrip and he has badly damaged strat fighters.
      If you have lvl3 airstrip you should hit twice before his attack.
      -He ignores the airstrip and goes for base. In this scenerio you will hit him 2 or 3 times before he reaches your city and you finish them when they go back. So his start bombers are very expensive rockets basicly.
      Or, you go with the Fox-Company Strategy and send in a bunch of fighters with tactical's and then the strat's after.
      "I have not failed, i have just found 10,000 ways that wont work." - Thomas Edison

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    • Sewur wrote:

      Fox-Company wrote:

      Or, you go with the Fox-Company Strategy and send in a bunch of fighters with tactical's and then the strat's after.
      If you had such army, lets say 20 interceptors, 10 tact, 10 strat then your enemy can easily have 50 interceptors well researched and advantage in different areas. So im not sure if thats optimal.
      Now you are conjuring up interceptors out of thin air, you're situations are un-real and no one just makes 50 interceptors, it would be a horrible waste of resources, espically if i only had a few strats, interceptors and some tact's
      "I have not failed, i have just found 10,000 ways that wont work." - Thomas Edison

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    • Danieliyoverde123 wrote:

      Its easy to defeat interceptor or rocket fighter with steath bombers trust me i know, got 20 panasian interceptors and lose them against 10 allies strat bombers even when i was microing my interceptors
      Unless you for some reason don't have air bases that are out of range of his strats I'm not sure I'm following. An equal number of interceptors easily beat strats at a massive production resource/time advantage. You can even kill the strats without taking any damage by simply patrolling over the city they are bombing. You can throw in other plane types to help out on this also. Anti air is likewise way overpower strats. Of course, the strats will damage your buildings, but the time/resource war should be heavily against the strats overall. If you are caught off guard and mistakenly have planes landed at an airbase that is hit by strats well, that's the one advantage of strats. That's what you need to guard against defensively and what you want to exploit if you are using strats offensively.

    • Fox-Company wrote:

      Sewur wrote:

      Fox-Company wrote:

      Or, you go with the Fox-Company Strategy and send in a bunch of fighters with tactical's and then the strat's after.
      If you had such army, lets say 20 interceptors, 10 tact, 10 strat then your enemy can easily have 50 interceptors well researched and advantage in different areas. So im not sure if thats optimal.
      Now you are conjuring up interceptors out of thin air, you're situations are un-real and no one just makes 50 interceptors, it would be a horrible waste of resources, espically if i only had a few strats, interceptors and some tact's
      Haha yeah, when you delete counters to your tactics from equation then they will always work. Who would have thought?
      Building your airforce stacks takes time so it's not like you have not and boom you have all stacked and leveled. Your opponent will adjust obviously.

    • Danieliyoverde123 wrote:

      just in case you didnt know, strat bombers do damage to structures in patrol, theres no need to go back for refueling.
      Juses, i didn't know this.
      "I have not failed, i have just found 10,000 ways that wont work." - Thomas Edison

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    • Thanks for asking.

      Sewur wrote:

      Just wondering. As Pan-asian cant you hit his bombers once and have enough time to refuel? Its 30% difference in speed between slowest and fastest planes (not counting rocket fighters). With upgraded airstrip you have 10min refueling time.


      It's impossible you can sustain bombing airstrips with aa while being hit by interceptors. Every such attack puts you way behind for the next attack. (damaged strat bombers are slow af so basicly usless).


      And you are the one who can constantly invade his air space because you have air superiority. So you should be the one with initiative. Pan-asian with air superiority over Allies means you can run around his troops all day and he cant respond.


      If he has 10 strat bombers he probably lacks tactical bombers to follow so lets say you have airstrip lvl1 with 20interceptors.
      My point exactly. Used correctly, heavy bombers aren't a waste of resources, but they do use up sufficient resources that defending from strats is always cheaper than using them (if one has the brains to defend properly with ideal force concentration). ;)

      So if I have air superiority in my own sky, or can otherwise defend adequately, I am already winning. And if he has lots of heavy bombers he probably lacks other planes I probably can dominate his skies as well. Either way, all else being equal, his planes lose and I will assume the offensive role ASAPracticable.

      On a side note, I would put 20 interceptors on an airstrip, even if I could muster that number. Especially not a lvl.1. And I always have a way to fall back.

      Sewur wrote:

      He has 2 options:
      -He attacks the airstrip. So you hit him once with interceptors before his attack. And he destroys your airstrip loaded with aa. 30min and you have new airstrip and he has badly damaged strat fighters.
      If you have lvl3 airstrip you should hit twice before his attack.
      -He ignores the airstrip and goes for base. In this scenerio you will hit him 2 or 3 times before he reaches your city and you finish them when they go back. So his start bombers are very expensive rockets basicly.
      If he attacks my cities, he's dead because that's where most of my AA are. Airstrips and forts are second priority, cities first if they contain valuable buildings.
      Aeroplanes are interesting toys but of no military value.
      — Marshal Foch

      A pretty mechanical toy [...] the war will never be won by such machines.
      — Lord Kitchener, on tanks