For number nerds only: dxcalc.com/rank.cow.units
Cow Unit Ranker
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Clicked through, clicked Rank Units, and immediately saw 1) Militia, so I approve.
But honestly, looks cool and I'll play around with it a bit. Nice job. -
Some results are counterintuitive but I think I understand them. For example, I interpret this first search as "give me the most cost effective units to attack an unknown ground unit at range, ignoring speed entirely" (for now, giving all resources equal weight, which is not accurate but let's roll with it anyways)
With this second search, I changed it to "all of that but now I reeeeally care about speed" and it spits out a list that, strangely, mixes up the order of the different Artillery levels. This doesn't seem right at first glance, but I guess it's telling me "if you really, really care about speed, then you can actually get more speed for your resources with lower level artillery", implying that the speed increases for higher levels don't keep pace with the increased resource costs. Obviously not a very helpful scenario (that's what I get for giving the model weird inputs) but I think it's understandable and results in some interesting insights. -
Some other thoughts:
- it'd be cool to set a min and max day instead of a min/max level, like "show me the most cost effective units assuming I only have access to research levels up to day 10". This would be a lot harder to code, I assume, and would also vary by doctrine, but would be kinda cool. As it is, max level doesn't tell the whole story, since some units have 7 and others have just 3 or 4 (or even just 1 level)
- another more complicated idea that could be interesting would be to allow the user to input their resource generation rates and to optimize based on time, either by determining the limiting resource and just using that one or by combining all resource types but converting them to a single unit (e.g. hours) rather than relying on the user to weight them properly
- I assume this is looking purely at raw damage outputs, not as percentage of the target unit's health, which may overvalue units that specialize in heavy armor vs those that specialize in unarmored, since heavy armor targets tend to have more HP and thus each attack does less damage as a percentage of their total health. I dunno how to account for that yet. -
jubjub bird wrote:
but I guess it's telling me "if you really, really care about speed, then you can actually get more speed for your resources with lower level artillery", implying that the speed increases for higher levels don't keep pace with the increased resource costs.
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jubjub bird wrote:
it'd be cool to set a min and max day instead of a min/max level, like "show me the most cost effective units assuming I only have access to research levels up to day 10". This would be a lot harder to code, I assume, and would also vary by doctrine, but would be kinda cool. As it is, max level doesn't tell the whole story, since some units have 7 and others have just 3 or 4 (or even just 1 level)
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jubjub bird wrote:
another more complicated idea that could be interesting would be to allow the user to input their resource generation rates and to optimize based on time, either by determining the limiting resource and just using that one or by combining all resource types but converting them to a single unit (e.g. hours) rather than relying on the user to weight them properly
jubjub bird wrote:
I assume this is looking purely at raw damage outputs, not as percentage of the target unit's health, which may overvalue units that specialize in heavy armor vs those that specialize in unarmored
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Agreed on the second point, I couldn't come up with a better method.
For the first one, the idea is to convert all the resources required by a unit into a single value, time, which varies based on the user's generation rates (e.g. I need 2 hours of Food, 1 hour of Goods, 0.5 hours of Oil, 0.5 hours of Money, and 3 hours of Manpower, so the total cost of this unit is 7 "resource hours"). This would prevent the user from having to adjust the weights they give to the different resources manually, instead taking their exact situation to tell them which units would utilize their resources well. -
I like the idea, but it seems pretty specific and limiting. I would imagine a more common usage would be, say, a player knows they tend to run out of rares and manpower and just want to know what units are best that don't use a lot of these. Or a bunch of other possible needs ... Simply using your resource production rates wouldn't account for the variable usage of those resources. I guess if you were starting from scratch with no preconceived idea of what units you were going to build and were ok with ignoring variable resource usage of building construction this might be useful. But, in that case you would probably be better off trying to estimate your resource production over time given the number of resource cores etc you have, in which case, you may as well just use weights.
ps. This also wouldn't take into account market availability of a resource. There is just so many things to consider, it's probably best for the player to have a sense of what resources are most valuable based on experience. The resources you commonly find yourself low on is probably a good start.The post was edited 1 time, last by DxC ().
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for me it seems its ignoring a bit that the stack limit for damage vs a single type is at 10 best units from the stack(I know its not exactly like it...but its good eghough to say)..... so for big stacks its pretty bad....I think its also a reason why Militia is here sooo extrem strong at least for defending.... the maximum damage which an only militia stack could be is lower as the maximum damage from anarmored cars stack..... jeah sure till 10 units militia is much cheaper for each point damage but the damage from militia never reaches the maximum of 10 armored cars damage.....doesn't matter how many militia you ad to that...... (also the scout fuction is not rated there).... I dont understand why it looks for me like a lower militia has more hp as a higher lvl one...seems like I should look first at the calculator....(I just looked 10 seconds at it)..before posting here stuff....:
(and sry that I just say negativ points but I think the positiv stuff is for me tooo boring to say often xD...I like to cry at others... wanted to delete this post..still dont know how to delete)The post was edited 3 times, last by Blauer Drache ().
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Blauer Drache wrote:
nd sry that I just say negativ points but I think the positiv stuff is for me tooo boring to say often
Blauer Drache wrote:
for me it seems its ignoring a bit that the stack limit for damage vs a single type is at 10 best units
Blauer Drache wrote:
also the scout fuction is not rated there
Blauer Drache wrote:
I dont understand why it looks for me like a lower militia has more hp as a higher lvl one
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DxC wrote:
I suppose I could just use some inverse of the absolute speed scaled to the other score values and let that influence the total score based on user input speed weights without regard to resources.
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DxC wrote:
Maybe I could allow the user to specify an expected average stack size and base the calculation off of that.
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So I went a bit loony and am having units fight a godzillion hypothetical bosses. Basically, I'm trying to evaluate the ability of a unit type to deal damage over its lifetime. This may not be the perfect measure and there are still balancing issues, but this might be a good starting point. Here is a description from the help file.
Unit evaluation (damage dealt)
The benefit of a particular unit, given the various weights, is a measure of how much hypothetical damage it can inflict before it dies. For each target armor class, the unit, in a stack of specified size, will fight a hypothetical boss stack that has equal attack and defense power for all armor classes. If the boss is killed, another will appear, and you will fight that one starting at the HP you have left. This continues until your stack is dead. The total amount of damage you deal to the bosses before you die is the denominator in the score = resource / denominator.
When attacking, ranged units (artillery types, battleships and cuisers) are assumed to take no damage so they could potentially deal infinite damage. Instead, these units are assigned the following large damage value vs a given armor class: (power vs given armor) * (unit HP) * (stack size). This may be modified for better balancing in the future. -
Added user options for setting the HP and strength of the boss. Also fixed some bugs, including some issues with the battle calculations.
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jubjub bird wrote:
it'd be cool to set a min and max day instead of a min/max level
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